asian malaysian
Avatar Kyoshi
Let me hear you say this ship is bananas! B-A-NA-N-A-S!
Posts: 1,308
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Post by asian malaysian on Sept 28, 2008 22:13:53 GMT -5
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Ana
Metalbending Cop
Posts: 5,061
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Post by Ana on Sept 28, 2008 22:29:08 GMT -5
Oh, wow. I know Nick as creative control but, like asian malaysian said, Avatar is everyone on the staff's baby. I have a hard time seeing them giving up something that big and from this interview back in April 07 it seems like they really didn't/planned it that way.
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Post by dragonflly on Sept 29, 2008 22:53:30 GMT -5
That interview makes it sound like it was all planned from the beginning, unless I read it wrong, which is entirely possible.
Back to the topic, Zuko's determination is what it's all been about for me. The boy just never gives up. He never stopped trying to get the Avatar, and he wasn't about to give up on JOINING the Avatar either. Ok that temper had me addicted as well. Even though Zuko may have acted like an a$$, and a spoiled rotten jerk, Aang was just way too childish for my taste. When things got tough, he'd run away and get angry with his friends. Zuko was always angry woth Iroh, we can't count that.
Ok so it's alot of things that went into my decision, it's not that I dislike anything at all about Aang, his personality isn't my cup of tea. I like my boys a little, gritty and broody. Over cheeriness would make me want to strangle him!
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nandireya
Zuko's Path to Redemption Mod
...tickled pink...
Posts: 6,822
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Post by nandireya on Oct 1, 2008 1:54:36 GMT -5
Just thought I'd mention this... I went to an Anime festival in NYC this weekend, and there was a fandom discussion on ATLA led by Anime journalists/theorists that had been in close contact with Nickelodeon and ATLA writers. Apparently, the ATLA writers (Bryke included) didn't initially plan for Zuko to join Azula at the end of S2. He wasn't necessarily going to join the GAang, but he definitely wasn't going to betray Iroh/Katara/etc like he did. When I asked why this original plan was changed, the panelists essentially said it was Nickelodeon (which had ultimate creative control) that made the decision.So for those of you, like me, who were shocked when Zuko joined Azula, I just wanted to reassure you that this shock is justified. So it's Nick's fault that I went from a fan to a viewer and stopped buying every single piece of Avatar merchandise available? Way to go Nick!
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Grandi
Bato
Prince of All Cosmos
Posts: 603
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Post by Grandi on Oct 1, 2008 1:57:08 GMT -5
I actually liked the betrayal. In my opinion it brought out some decent character depth and plot points. I'm not so in love with a character that I can't stand to see them do anything wrong. Zuko had some definite unresolved issues and it brought them to light spectacularly.
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nandireya
Zuko's Path to Redemption Mod
...tickled pink...
Posts: 6,822
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Post by nandireya on Oct 1, 2008 1:59:03 GMT -5
I would have been fine with it if something worthwhile had actually come out of it. I can count the number of season three episodes I truly enjoyed on one hand.
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Grandi
Bato
Prince of All Cosmos
Posts: 603
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Post by Grandi on Oct 1, 2008 2:26:32 GMT -5
I'm confused about what you mean out of worthwhile? It gave his character a previous depth that was unknown and highlighted his internal moral struggles. I can't see what more you would want.
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nandireya
Zuko's Path to Redemption Mod
...tickled pink...
Posts: 6,822
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Post by nandireya on Oct 1, 2008 3:55:14 GMT -5
It's not just Zuko it's the story in general...I simply didn't care for the direction it went...to me it was like they ran out of ideas. There were bits I liked (and they were never to be mentioned again), but overall it lost its appeal for me.
It's happened before...I'm a comic geek...and I've gotten highly involved in certain titles, then it goes in a new direction that I don't care for...I hang around for a while to see if things pick up again...but eventually I simply stop buying the book...
It's a personal thing...there are many who like how the show went...but I know I'm not the only one who didn't. You just can't please all of the people all of the time.
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Post by nymphadora on Oct 1, 2008 16:15:00 GMT -5
I loved the actual betrayal, but afterwards I didn't like what happened to Zuko. He was so.....passive for a while and had never been like that before, so it got boring. There was no continuous 'bad guy' in a lot of season 3 - besides Ozai who doesn't really count IMO because he isn't an active character a lot. The Zuko and Aang storylines were too disconnected for me. :/
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Post by bacwas on Oct 8, 2008 11:13:43 GMT -5
I voted for Zuko. Don't get me wrong...Aang is a sweet, positive young man. And I really like him.
But there's something about Zuko that just draws me in. He's got sweetness and positivity too, but it was crushed for so long that it took a long time for it to resurface.
Some people take issue with Zuko in Season 3. He was definitely not happy before he joined Aang. You can see the misery on his face most of the time. It's almost like he thought "well I made a decision, one that I'm very unsure of and doesn't make me feel good, but I have to live with it now." If he wasn't conflicted, he would not have gone to see Iroh. But he does and Zuko's confusion is palpable. He wants Iroh to set him straight. But Iroh wants Zuko to finally figure it out for himself. There has always been this underlying desperation in Zuko...he's desperate for his father's approval, love, acceptance. (Don't abused children seek the love and approval of their abuser???) In early season 3 he has the approval, but not the love. But that approval has come because of false information given to Ozai by Azula. Now Zuko has to wonder if his father would approve of him if he knew the truth. Zuko's angry and cranky for the first part of Season 3(except for a few moments with Mai..and why shouldn't he enjoy some affection?) He lashes out at others such as MAi and Iroh. That's what people do when they are twisted up inside. They take out their anger at themselves at whoever is closest.
Give the guy credit, one he makes the decision to join Aang, he goes for it 100%. He confronts his father which takes a lot of courage for Zuko. He tells his father that the war is a lie, that the Fire Nation is hated and feared and that it's all wrong, that things must change. He doesn't waste time joining Aang. He approaches them right away. That took a lot of courage also. He humbled himself and in the end spoke eloquently to Aang. He took teaching Aang firebending very seriously. Zuko spoke constantly of Iroh. His sorrow over his betrayal of Iroh was very evident. Zuko finally realizes Iroh's meaning in his life. He realizes that Iroh is his father. He shows great selflessnes in The Boiling Rock. He sympathizes with Sokka and does his best to help and encourage him. As far as The Southern Raiders goes.......Zuko does make 2 smart Equus asinus comments to Aang. But it's not like Toph and Sokka don't make remarks like that all the time. It shows how much more comfortable Zuko is with Aang. I definitely agree that Zuko was pretty desperate for Katara to accept him. Her coldness bothered him a lot. So Zuko encouraged the trip with her. He wanted to prove himself to Katara.....see, I'm on your side, I'll help you. And Zuko was a big enough person at the end of TSR to admit to Aang that he was wrong about Katara needing violence to settle her anger re her mother's death.
In the final episodes, I see a Zuko much more at ease with himself, a guy able to smile and laugh, tell jokes and enjoy the company of friends. He's still intense, but that's Zuko. He supplicates himself before Iroh, takes charge of the gaang, takes a hit for Katara etc and is looking forward to changing the world with his friend, Aang. He's happy with a girl(see the contented smile on his face when he hugs Mai) and enjoys serving tea to his friends at Iroh's tea shop.
I loved watching Zuko's journey with it's many ups and downs, twists and turns. I knew he was a great guy underneath all the misery and pain.
Geez, did I get long winded. Sorry. I just hope that some of what I said makes sense.
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Post by shanarulez520 on Oct 8, 2008 17:14:12 GMT -5
I voted for Aang. I love Aang he is soooooo sweet!!! He's so cute and funny and i love his pesonality! That is one reson i wish that i was katara...
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Post by bride744 on Oct 11, 2008 0:54:23 GMT -5
Honestly, I like Zuko's personality WAY better than Aang's. Aang is just too "uppy-puppy" for me. I like how Zuko is very serious but has a sweet inside. He remisnds me a lot of myself and I LUV HIM TO DEATH!!!!!!!!!!!!
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Post by bacwas on Oct 11, 2008 7:15:32 GMT -5
Yeah, like people say about Spike from the Buffyverse, Zuko's like a pineapple...he has a prickly exterior but he's sweet on the inside. I think that Zuko will mellow out even more as he gets a bit older. After all, he has friends and love in his life now... and let's not forget inner peace. Though he does have a tough road ahead of him as Firelord.
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Post by Amira on Oct 11, 2008 14:48:41 GMT -5
Aang's bright personality is what makes him more appealing to me. The positivity in the face of such overwhelming odds. The sweetness in the face of a situation that was beyond imaginable. I know some people find that annoying but I find it refreshing and appealing.
Zuko often grated on my nerves.
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nandireya
Zuko's Path to Redemption Mod
...tickled pink...
Posts: 6,822
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Post by nandireya on Oct 11, 2008 17:02:35 GMT -5
Is it just me...or do most Zuko fans like Aang but most Aang fans think Zuko sucks?
Just an observation...
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