|
Post by akako on Jul 24, 2008 21:09:30 GMT -5
I've noticed that quite a few people are unhappy with how Aang resolved the conflict with Ozai. Aang could not and would not take the life of another human being, no matter how depraved and wretched it was. Acting on the dictates on his own conscience and beliefs and using what he learned from the Lion Turtle (a being that has undoubtedly been around long enough to know), Aang took away Ozai's bending.
Now some of you may look at this as a cheap cop-out. But think about it; Aang, although the Avatar, is a twelve year old boy. People in his world seem to forget that fact. Remember how he reacted when he found out he was the Avatar? He wasn't supposed to know until he was sixteen. Think of the emotional impact it would have had on the poor kid if he took another human life. It would have destroyed him, his friends and ultimately have impacted the rest of the world.
And secondly, if you really stop to think about it, Ozai's punishment is far more fitting and appropriate than dying at the hands of his sworn enemy.
IF Aang had killed Ozai in the battle, he would have been viewed by any of his supporters as a 'martyr'; he'd have been mourned and grieved by people of the Fire Nation and his name would have been used as a rallying cry against not only the Avatar, but Zuko as the new Fire Lord and any allies they have gathered for themselves. Such a thing could ultimately have erupted into a full-blown civil war within the Fire Nation itself between Zuko's supporters and Ozai sympathizers. A living Ozai, stripped of his powers and imprisoned for life makes a far more humbling example. While there will still be some pockets of resistance within the Fire Nation and their colonies due to this 'changing of the guard', they are not going to throw their support behind a Fire Lord who was defeated (at his most powerful, I should add) and stripped of his powers by a twelve year old kid.
Another thing to keep in mind is; there are some things that are worse than death. Three days before the comet, Fire Lord Ozai had declared himself Phoenix King. He was going to be ruler of the world. With the comet, he was imbued by it's power. He was the most powerful firebender alive at the time. He believed he was going to defeat and kill the Avatar.
Think about it; all Ozai has now are the ragged clothes on his back. He was stripped of all he possessed; his title, his status, his armies, numerous supporters and worst of all... his fire bending. I'm willing to bet that Ozai would have preferred death. Death, I think in his view, would have held more honor and dignity for someone as proud, arrogant and narcissistic as himself. Instead, he will live out the rest of his days locked up in prison by the very son he had banished three years previous. The son he himself had deemed a failure. He will be an object of ridicule, humiliation and disgust forevermore by the world, including his own people.
And that, fellow Avatards, is karmic justice.
|
|
asian malaysian
Avatar Kyoshi
Let me hear you say this ship is bananas! B-A-NA-N-A-S!
Posts: 1,308
|
Post by asian malaysian on Jul 24, 2008 21:35:02 GMT -5
^^ I dont know that I agree that Ozai "..was the most powerful firebender alive at the time." but, otherwise, I largely agree with your stated views.
|
|
|
Post by goten0040 on Jul 24, 2008 23:54:53 GMT -5
I agree with what you said. I think it's a great justice to end up rotting in a cell, faced with the lack of his power and having to live with the fact that he lost to a twelve year old.
|
|
|
Post by avatarjanicki on Jul 25, 2008 1:44:24 GMT -5
Destiny is funny, how it works, how it unwinds down. I know any punishment should fit the crime, and Aang even admitted that the world would probably be better without Ozai. However, think of his main element, Air. The Air Nomads teach their young that they have to seperate themselves from the world to gain spiritual enlightenment, Air Nomads sound like they oppose death and really don't wish it on the world. Now if Aang was from the Earth or Water nations, perhaps the upbringing would have been different.
However, we do not know if there was an Avatar that killed the bad guy. Kyoshi admitted to the crime, but Aang was right in beliving that Chin was too stubborn to get out of the way and it led to his own doom. I'll guess we have to wait for something else to answer the really hard questions.
|
|
ƒelinoel
Teo
Order of the White Lotus Grandmaster
Would you care for a game of Pai Sho?
Posts: 425
|
Post by ƒelinoel on Jul 26, 2008 21:56:19 GMT -5
Also, people seem to be able to live for hundreds of years, so that makes a twelve year old much younger for them then it is for us
|
|
|
Post by dragonflly on Jul 27, 2008 23:12:11 GMT -5
I said a very long time ago that I'd love to see him in prison so he could see Zuko undo all that he has done. But I'm disappointed in this, he deserved to die. I know Aang is only 12, but after all he has done, it is only justified. I know 2 wrongs don't make a right, but in this case, even though he is suffering and humiliated, death was a suitable punishment.
I will admit that I loved seeing Zuko go into the prison after he was coronated. I just wish Zuko would have added the fact that he told the Avatar to kill him, just to see Ozai's face.
|
|
ƒelinoel
Teo
Order of the White Lotus Grandmaster
Would you care for a game of Pai Sho?
Posts: 425
|
Post by ƒelinoel on Jul 27, 2008 23:14:56 GMT -5
I said a very long time ago that I'd love to see him in prison so he could see Zuko undo all that he has done. But I'm disappointed in this, he deserved to die. I know Aang is only 12, but after all he has done, it is only justified. I know 2 wrongs don't make a right, but in this case, even though he is suffering and humiliated, death was a suitable punishment. I will admit that I loved seeing Zuko go into the prison after he was coronated. I just wish Zuko would have added the fact that he told the Avatar to kill him, just to see Ozai's face. Its not that he didn't kill Ozai because he was only twelve, its because it was against everything he was taught and believed in
|
|
Kataang101
Mai
100 years alone, Forever Together
Posts: 4,398
|
Post by Kataang101 on Jul 28, 2008 11:16:47 GMT -5
Extremely good point akako and i agree with you all the way. ima karma u cuz dat was really good. *karma*
|
|
|
Post by admirality on Jul 28, 2008 13:26:01 GMT -5
He may not hav his bending, armies and funky pheonix hat but he still has admirality I agree with what u said... it is a worse punishment for him than death but as his adorning fangirl I'm just glad he aint dead.... He may not be totally useless from here on...... In the event of war breaking out between the nations again then he cud be useful for the FN again as a straegist Zuko himself said Ozai is god at war...
|
|
ƒelinoel
Teo
Order of the White Lotus Grandmaster
Would you care for a game of Pai Sho?
Posts: 425
|
Post by ƒelinoel on Jul 28, 2008 13:55:08 GMT -5
He may not hav his bending, armies and funky pheonix hat but he still has admirality I agree with what u said... it is a worse punishment for him than death but as his adorning fangirl I'm just glad he aint dead.... He may not be totally useless from here on...... In the event of war breaking out between the nations again then he cud be useful for the FN again as a straegist Zuko himself said Ozai is god at war... Plus... look at him, he would make a good soldier, though I doubt he would like that
|
|
asian malaysian
Avatar Kyoshi
Let me hear you say this ship is bananas! B-A-NA-N-A-S!
Posts: 1,308
|
Post by asian malaysian on Jul 28, 2008 19:21:33 GMT -5
^^ I doubt it. He wasnt prepared to take on his own son without firebending. I have a feeling he's relied on it a bit too much over the years for him to make an effective solider without it.
|
|
|
Post by akako on Jul 28, 2008 21:39:36 GMT -5
I said a very long time ago that I'd love to see him in prison so he could see Zuko undo all that he has done. But I'm disappointed in this, he deserved to die. I know Aang is only 12, but after all he has done, it is only justified. I know 2 wrongs don't make a right, but in this case, even though he is suffering and humiliated, death was a suitable punishment. I will admit that I loved seeing Zuko go into the prison after he was coronated. I just wish Zuko would have added the fact that he told the Avatar to kill him, just to see Ozai's face. One need only look at the episode 'Avatar Day' to know what effect killing Ozai outright would have had on the Fire Nation public. Chin the Conqueror was a ruthless, power-hungry General who tried to take hold of the entire Earth Kingdom. He went so far as to defy Avatar Kyoshi. In the end, his own arrogance led to his demise, yet Kyoshi sees herself as responsible for his death. As a result, the people of Chin viewed Chin himself as a 'great man who was ruthlessly killed by Avatar Kyoshi' and until Aang saved their town, they viewed the Avatar as a villain. As I said before, had Aang killed Fire Lord Ozai, it would have led to outright rebellion within the Fire Nation and their colonies. While Zuko as the new Fire Lord and Aang will still have their work cut out for them and while there will still be some descent among the public and military alike, imagine what happened in that one town on a Fire Nation scale. Not a pretty picture, is it?
|
|
|
Post by Victim ~*of *~Circumstances on Jul 28, 2008 22:22:22 GMT -5
I agree with you. It is karmic justice but I still find it strange that Aang keeps saying it was against what he was taught and believed in. Mainly because, when we were introduced to the Southern Air Temple we see Gyatso's dead body with Fire Nation soldier remnants around him. Now how did those Fire Nation soldiers die I wonder? Course, Aang had that Lion Turtle and that luckily precise rock so thankfully he was spared from the last resort. I guess it's good, wouldn't want the little guy to have another trauma but it's still kinda iffy.
|
|
asian malaysian
Avatar Kyoshi
Let me hear you say this ship is bananas! B-A-NA-N-A-S!
Posts: 1,308
|
Post by asian malaysian on Jul 28, 2008 22:25:03 GMT -5
akako-I dont see any reason to believe that imprisoning Ozai would cause less of a risk of the scenario that youre describing. People who would imagine that Ozai was wrongfully killed would probably just as likely believe that he was wrongfully imprisoned. Ozai certainly wont disabuse them of this notion. In fact, as long as he lives there will be a risk that there are those who may try to break Ozai out of prison and put him back on the throne.
|
|
asian malaysian
Avatar Kyoshi
Let me hear you say this ship is bananas! B-A-NA-N-A-S!
Posts: 1,308
|
Post by asian malaysian on Jul 28, 2008 22:33:37 GMT -5
I agree with you. It is karmic justice but I still find it strange that Aang keeps saying it was against what he was taught and believed in. Mainly because, when we were introduced to the Southern Air Temple we see Gyatso's dead body with Fire Nation soldier remnants around him. Now how did those Fire Nation soldiers die I wonder? Course, Aang had that Lion Turtle and that luckily precise rock so thankfully he was spared from the last resort. I guess it's good, wouldn't want the little guy to have another trauma but it's still kinda iffy. I think self-defence in life or death struggles are one of the legitimate cop out scenarios recognised even by the monks. As the Avatar, Aang was in a position to render Ozai completely helpless before killing him so he had a decision to make.
|
|