Pleading Eyes
Kyoshi Mai
I feel violated... and crispy
Posts: 2,327
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Post by Pleading Eyes on May 16, 2008 18:08:22 GMT -5
People shouldn't complain about a villain being too powerful. People shouldn't complain about people complaining about a villain being too powerful.
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Post by Milkman on May 17, 2008 8:32:35 GMT -5
I don't think Azula is to powerfull, she is smart enough to plot every move out but she still can be wrong like part 2 showed. She did not anticipated that Mai would help out Zuko. That scene showed that she is not almighty and is the only scene i can remember where she loses her temper and control over te situation.
I think the flight of Azula is a bit over the top. The fight on top of the gondola did not leave much room for some awesome bending battle making the fight scene look rather dull. Except for the gondola fight scene and Azula flying the boiling rock i prt 1 and 2 are great episodes.
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Sheogorath
Kyoshi Azula
Lord of the Never-There
Yeah, an Avatard and a brony. Got a problem with that?
Posts: 2,223
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Post by Sheogorath on May 19, 2008 2:38:19 GMT -5
I just watched WAT, FBM, and both parts of BR online a little while ago, and all I can say is this: I'm shocked. That Combustion Man was still alive, sure, but moreso at Mai and Ty Lee's outright betrayal of Azula. Never mind Azula's flying. Heat can lift things, and it goes to show that she has such control over her own power that she can do that. Mai stopping the guards from cutting the line so Zuko and the others can escape? Shocker. Mai admitting that she loves Zuko MORE than she fears Azula? Shocker. Ty Lee doing her chi-blocking thing on Azula? Major shocker. And a very interesting plot twist.
And I think Azula losing her temper over Mai and Ty Lee's betrayal was resonable for her. Remember, she did say she wanted them locked up in a place she'd never see them again and let them rot. That said, we all know she's used to planning things in advance, and even if things don't go exactly as planned, she's always got another plan, or can come up with one quickly. So when the two non-family members closest to her up and betray her like that, that she should respond in such a way, while being so upset is slightly out of character, should be expected.
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Post by Milkman on May 19, 2008 11:42:12 GMT -5
I don't think that Azula being upset is out of character at all. I love that part, it's the first real sign that the firenation is losing control over the situation and it shows that even Azula can be catched offguard. She is human to I'm really wondering what part Mai and Ty Lee are going to play in the remaining 6 episodes.
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Post by Alouncara on May 19, 2008 13:24:00 GMT -5
If you think about it Azula wasn't sky rocketing going alll over the place... In fact she used hand cuffs and her jet propelled shoes to get to the gondola, not just flying voer there. All she's doing is pushing herself upward withe the fire so zuko could probably do the same thing if she learned how... It did look kind afunny though xD
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melloyello
Appa
Beware the Chittering Monkey
Posts: 229
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Post by melloyello on May 19, 2008 15:51:39 GMT -5
I don't have a problem with Azula getting angry, but I am upset that she left Ty Lee & Mai in the hands of Mai's uncle, who just had five people breakout of his unescapable prison. Azula is a far more vengeful person than that. This is the biggest betrayal she has ever experienced, and there had to be at least some emotional pain involved, since the girls effectively chose her loser older brother over her. Azula acting in character would've demanded their deaths immediately, or waited until she was able to kill them herself.
Obviously, this wouldn't be allowed in the show, but showing Azula leaving the girls in the cooler, & having Azula say something like 'throw away the key', could work. Or having Azula order the girls to be locked up so she can deal with kill them later is an option. Having Azula walk away from them without any real consequence is totally out of character and obviously points to Mai & Ty Lee escaping completely unscathed.
It seems like such a cliche saturday morning cartoon moment, with the ultimate evil, all-powerful villan who somehow makes a completely boneheaded mistake that completely destroys his plan. I really thought Avatar was better than this.
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Post by Fire Lord Azula on May 19, 2008 19:25:50 GMT -5
Having Azula walk away from them without any real consequence is totally out of character and obviously points to Mai & Ty Lee escaping completely unscathed. You make such excellent points about the toning-down of Azula's character. You just earned yourself an exaltation. Azula is a vengeful, violent, unforgiving despot. To begin with, betrayal is a grievous crime. For two trusted -- and perhaps Azula should be faulted for trusting two girls who openly admonished Zuko -- confidants to turn traitor, and for her to simply throw them in an overrated prison? Very strange. Ordinarily, her character type would have, as you said, ordered their execution... or tortured them. Yet, it's possible that she will torture them behind closed doors, but we'll never know about it. It does point to their inevitable escape.
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mj
Momo
Posts: 29
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Post by mj on May 19, 2008 22:23:13 GMT -5
I thought Azula flying was one of the cheesiest things I have ever seen. Really I thought that scene in CoD was bad enough, the jet propelled Azula at Aang, but this went way beyond bad.
I agree... the whole flying thing, was just... tacky. It looks... I don't know, out of place. On the other hand, Ty Lee sprinting across the ropes, now that looks more action-y. But then, I try to think, how else would have Azula gotten onto the gondola?
Kudos to Ty Lee for her acrobatic skills, and Suki and Ty Lee for their gondola fight, (my favorite was when Ty Lee went off the gondola, through the gondola, and back on top) but maybe something a little more... Azula next time?
"I don't have a problem with Azula getting angry, but I am upset that she left Ty Lee & Mai in the hands of Mai's uncle, who just had five people breakout of his unescapable prison."
And I don't know Melloyello, but I highly doubt that The Warden is going to be the Warden for much longer. (Even though we'll probably never know.) Whether Ozai himself punishes him, or The Warden self-inflicts punishment for his shame, I think that there will be a new warden in the Boiling Rock.
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pg15
Avatar Roku
"Since beginningless time, darkness thrives in the void, but always yields to purifying light."
Posts: 1,248
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Post by pg15 on May 20, 2008 0:20:23 GMT -5
I don't think it was ever said that Ty Lee and Mai are getting locked up in the Boiling Rock; it could be any prison.
Anyway, given the way Azula talked about her mom in The Beach, and the Ursa hallucination from the finale trailer, I think it's likely that Azula isn't really a cruel 1-D villain; she's just as complex as anyone else; it's just that most of it is hidden beneath that perfectly cold exterior. I think Azula, deep down, was hurt by her friends' actions but still don't want them dead because...well, they are her friends. Just as she seemingly wanted her mom's love, she wants her friends' affections as well.
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Sheogorath
Kyoshi Azula
Lord of the Never-There
Yeah, an Avatard and a brony. Got a problem with that?
Posts: 2,223
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Post by Sheogorath on May 20, 2008 0:48:06 GMT -5
I don't have a problem with Azula getting angry, but I am upset that she left Ty Lee & Mai in the hands of Mai's uncle, who just had five people breakout of his unescapable prison. Azula is a far more vengeful person than that. This is the biggest betrayal she has ever experienced, and there had to be at least some emotional pain involved, since the girls effectively chose her loser older brother over her. Azula acting in character would've demanded their deaths immediately, or waited until she was able to kill them herself. Obviously, this wouldn't be allowed in the show, but showing Azula leaving the girls in the cooler, & having Azula say something like 'throw away the key', could work. Or having Azula order the girls to be locked up so she can deal with kill them later is an option. Having Azula walk away from them without any real consequence is totally out of character and obviously points to Mai & Ty Lee escaping completely unscathed. It seems like such a cliche saturday morning cartoon moment, with the ultimate evil, all-powerful villan who somehow makes a completely boneheaded mistake that completely destroys his plan. I really thought Avatar was better than this. Now, I'm not saying Azula was completely out of character there. Her freaking out like that, that was out of character. She's been upset before, and will be again, but to explode like that? That's not like her at all. And I agree that she's the type to torture and possibly kill them rather than just having them locked up. If the show has taught us one thing, it's this: Azula is a liar and a schemer. A schemer whose schemes almost always work. You will remember that the drill failed, and they had to get into Ba Sing Se another way. For all we know, Azula said she never wants to see them again, but fully intended to find out where they'd been locked up later on, and go and exact swift and final vengeance on them, and deposit their corpses in the bottom of the Boiling Lake. Of course, they'd never show that, and I'm willing to bet that Mai and Ty Lee would play some part in the finale. Recap time: Azula wasn't entirely out of character. Being angry and quickly devising an at the moment harsh punishment? In character. Exploding and having that punishment merely being Mai and Ty Lee being locked up? That was out of character.
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pg15
Avatar Roku
"Since beginningless time, darkness thrives in the void, but always yields to purifying light."
Posts: 1,248
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Post by pg15 on May 20, 2008 3:03:05 GMT -5
I disagree.
Ask yourself this: has Azula ever been given this much reason to be upset? In an instant, her two closest friends and allies and trusted people, the only people who, beside her father, who really seemed to like her, betrayed her for Zuko, someone who she sees as inferior, weak, and a traitor. I don't think she's ever faced such a horrible experience. Note how she only lost her cool when Mai told her she miscalculated. Well, I think that hit a nerve, don't you? Look at how she got angry just because she was "1 hair out of place" in The Avatar State. Well, blowing that up a thousand fold with a mess her plans made in The Boiling Rock, and I think you'll see that she was in perfect character.
Azula is a lot more complex than people think. This wasn't out of character, it was just her character developing.
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Post by avatarjanicki on May 20, 2008 10:56:22 GMT -5
Am I the only one that thought that was pretty cool seeing Azula fly up to the gondola. Ty Lee was really something being able to balance herself on the ropes.
I am still shocked that Azula didn't scream back down to the people cutting the line to stop. I mean you got Azula and Ty Lee who are very well known. Azula would have been upset at those guards for cutting the line and should have bashed at them.
For some strange reason Mai should have said "I'm saving my uncle" instead of "saving the gerk that dumped me". She might have gotten away with that if she was really attached to her uncle, but really I don't think so at all.
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Xia-ya
Teo
☆ ☆ ☆ ☆ ☆
Posts: 422
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Post by Xia-ya on May 20, 2008 12:58:52 GMT -5
I dont think Mai knew that her uncle was up there. Correct if I'm wrong. I think deep deep down Azula is really upset that her friends betrayed her and betrayed for the one that she's been jealous of. Everyone is choosing Zuko over her.
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attonbitus
Blue Spirit
I'm in ur clouds, steel'n ur thundar
Posts: 2,121
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Post by attonbitus on May 20, 2008 14:53:08 GMT -5
Honestly, i feel that azula would want to do a public execution later as a reminder that being a traitor is not tolerated. Would work best in the FN colonies. There might be an out cry of support from FN nobles that didn't know the whole story though.
Locking up Tai Lee would be pointless if her hands were free. She could escape at any time. Mai not so much when she has no weapons.
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mj
Momo
Posts: 29
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Post by mj on May 20, 2008 21:28:36 GMT -5
True true, some very good points have been said.
I agree, Azula is a very complex character, but we never really got to see it since the only time we saw her, she pretty much blew everybody away, (except for The Drill, in which case we did not get to see her reaction to her failed plan.)
It's almost like Zuko in the first season, all we saw was him after the avatar, and then we saw his past, and his differences, and etc.
I think Azula just needs more time to show us who she really is.
And to Avatar Janicki: I don't thnk that Mai would have said something like that. If she would have said "I'm saving my uncle", then she probably wouldn't have told Azula that she miscalculated.
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