girlunderglass
Metalbending Cop
Runs With Scissors
Just STFU Already.
Posts: 5,014
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Post by girlunderglass on Sept 20, 2006 0:34:17 GMT -5
IDK.. I feel one reference would have been more than enough. As for them catering to fanservice... ;D They got us under their lil finger.
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elystia
Haru
Mine is an evil smirk
Posts: 338
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Post by elystia on Sept 20, 2006 0:59:42 GMT -5
I think I agree with the fanservice theory. And not just because I ship Kataang. (GUG, you might be able to appreciate this example.) My OTP in the FMA fandom is RoyEd, which is pretty much one of the biggest fanon pairings, if not one of the biggest pairings in general. And while a romantic relationship for them is certainly not canon, there's plenty of subtext and fanservice to keep it going. But I still wouldn't call that foreshadowing or anything like that. Just the creators being nice. I guess that's just my view on things. I don't take any of this too seriously though XD Sometimes we fans over-analyze the heck out of things. It's kind of weird for be to be on the other end of the ball field here, since RoyEd is like the Zutara of FMA fandom.
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Post by almighty on Sept 20, 2006 1:01:38 GMT -5
Yea... we're the puppets... and they're the puppeteers. ><
Amira: I'm also part of that minority. In fact, I came up with a theory stating that Zuko may be the ultimate bad guy in the end.. although I received endless flames from it. I don't care though.
I'll just reiterate my theory again.
When watching a television show, people always jump to conclusions about the antagonist. They always assume that the bad guy is "pure evil". Take avatar for example, I can safely say that the vast majority of the fandom hates Ozai. They know nothing of his past, yet they still jump to the conclusion that he is evil incarnate. What if Avatar is trying to be different? If Zuko were the ultimate bad guy, the audience already pity him and understand his motives which allows them to connect with the bad guy more. Creators normally never show the bad guy's point of view... but Avatar can be completely different.
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Post by rocio on Sept 20, 2006 1:26:35 GMT -5
mmmmmmmmmmmmmmm mmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm mmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm mmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm tic-toc-tic-toc............ (ah.....the time) The time............. We have a lot of time yet................ So......We don't worry....... Is better in that way. I mean................ If they put Zutara right now...... What the surprise will be???.............. But yes, I hope that in the end of this season Zuko would has more chances to know better the gang.......... Is pretty obvious that he is going to join the gang.......... When ?.....I don't know!............ The time will tell.................(pretty soon) Is only I or I want that Jet kiss katara? Yes, I'm ZUtarian. We already know that she will marry with a bender and who she will have a great romance with him. Then, is no problem.. Single it will offer more drama XD And I love the drama......What do you think?? (all of you?)
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Ana
Metalbending Cop
Posts: 5,061
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Post by Ana on Sept 20, 2006 9:16:35 GMT -5
And I seem to be one of the few people who does not want Zuko to join the Gaang. It will cease to be a Gaang and become more of a herd. I like the fact that Zuko and Iroh have their own path, their own story arc, their own issues. I don't want Zuko to join the gaang either. For the reasons you mentioned, Amira. Anyway, on the topic of the magazine: I think it's fan service. Which ship has the most fans? Zutara. So, if the mag had more Zutara it would please a larger amount of people and possibly more people would buy it. The fan service "theory" makes more sense considering how much stuff they excluded from the mag.
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Post by frozenwind141 on Sept 20, 2006 9:32:58 GMT -5
I also wouldn't particularly like Zuko to join the gaang for the same reason you said Amira. The creators do, do some unexpected things, but to me this isn't so unexpected.
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girlunderglass
Metalbending Cop
Runs With Scissors
Just STFU Already.
Posts: 5,014
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Post by girlunderglass on Sept 20, 2006 12:03:45 GMT -5
In fact, I came up with a theory stating that Zuko may be the ultimate bad guy in the end.. although I received endless flames from it. I don't care though. I'll just reiterate my theory again. When watching a television show, people always jump to conclusions about the antagonist. They always assume that the bad guy is "pure evil". Take avatar for example, I can safely say that the vast majority of the fandom hates Ozai. They know nothing of his past, yet they still jump to the conclusion that he is evil incarnate. What if Avatar is trying to be different? If Zuko were the ultimate bad guy, the audience already pity him and understand his motives which allows them to connect with the bad guy more. Creators normally never show the bad guy's point of view... but Avatar can be completely different. Not for nothing.. but that is pretty darn plausible. I would be in complete shock if Zuko was the ultimate bad guy by the end of the series. Yet, part of me would totally understand it. There has to be a major significance as to why we see Zuko's story run parallel to Aang's. Zuko has to have a higher purpose than just being the banished prince of the Fire Nation. Your well thought theory derserves karma.. and I have no issues paying up.
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Post by Paraiba Ocean on Sept 20, 2006 14:55:27 GMT -5
I don't want Zuko to join the gaang either. For the reasons you mentioned, Amira. Anyway, on the topic of the magazine: I think it's fan service. Which ship has the most fans? Zutara. So, if the mag had more Zutara it would please a larger amount of people and possibly more people would buy it. The fan service "theory" makes more sense considering how much stuff they excluded from the mag. The way I see it, Kataang and Zutara are on pretty equal teams, give or take a few fans. I didn't care if there was Kataang games only in the magazine, I still planned on buying it. Now, if you refer to the people who say "if Zutara doesn't happen, then I'm boycotting Avatar and never watching it again", (none I've met here) then probably yes. But there's a fair share of Kataangs who plan on boycotting Avatar if it doesn't happen (none I've met here). Why not put a Kataang game as well? That's one of the mysteries of the magazine to me. (Another is why is Zuko and Iroh still in season one clothing...but that's another story.) @almighty: Orly? That's an interesting theory. I've never thought of it...hrm...but I can understand why the vast majority hates Ozai. Most of them are Zuko fangirls...something about burning him sets them off...LOL.
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Post by rocio on Sept 20, 2006 19:30:48 GMT -5
I am studying for my text of analysis of international narrative structures. And while studied I found a dilemma.
Avatar belongs to the narrative classic, is no doubt of it. According to this, the hero is who the camera follows always. But Zuko, being the antagonist, the camera always follows him, and that is very outside the common thing.
It is logical that the hero is Aang, but Zuko has incredible characteristics of which in the codes in of the classic narration denominated the hero .
Although Aang continues being the hero, Zuko seems to be a second hero. And that is very confused, and it cannot be possible. Because single there is a one only one hero.
Then, I prepare my information, and I ask the subject at the senior instructor of the matter, my teacher of the university. And also he seems confused before the happened thing.
He said that Zuko, its case, is rare in the classic narrative and one of most attractive. He is the antagonistic heroic. Who is not evil, single he fulfills the duty, with his passion, that makes virtuoso and that makes a hero. But we know, the spectator, that he is not it.
Zuko is what the "him-self-man", the man that makes himself . They throw it of its country, deny its inheritance to him, its father rejects him. And even so he follows ahead. Is a character who accompanies the hero, generally.
My professor predicts, that in ahead, Zuko and Aang will be allied and/or friends. He was interested very with the character of Zuko, and according to him, he will get to take an adult paper in the gang. That according to my professor Zuko yes or yes it is going to integrate.
Believe it or not, the classic narrative is predictable, if one knows to analyze it, but always has surprises in the sense of how the things that one predict happens.
As soon as I comments to him about Zutara, he considered it logical. Already He explained to me a very simple code that all classic narrative follows.
The hero, Aang in this case, always is enamored with a girl at the beginning of history. But something happens that this relation cannot take shape. And during this acceptance of which the love was not corresponded or it did not work, there is a new girl of whom the hero is fallen in love.
My professor knows what he says. He said said it during the class, is part of the code also that the good girl always finishes with the assumption bad boy, that always in the end he turns out not to be so bad. XD
So................... About the magazine........... The classic narrative is uindustrial.....The money is very important in it...So...All is possible......
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The Blue Chibi
Cabbage Merchant
you cannot push the river... nor can you hold it back
Posts: 4,130
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Post by The Blue Chibi on Sept 20, 2006 20:18:40 GMT -5
Wow, rocio, that was cool!
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gambitia
Fiery Ozai
millions have trembled before my pink armor!
Posts: 5,894
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Post by gambitia on Sept 20, 2006 20:36:41 GMT -5
@amira: Ditto not liking the "Zuko joins Aang's Gang and everything is juuuust PEACHY!" theory.
@gug: Actually, the Zutara thing in the mag made me believe even more that Zutara won't happen. If there was a little blurb in Katara's bio that read "Aang has a crush on Katara, but he may not be the only contender for her affections..." then I would have taken it as possible future evidence. But everything was so heavy-handed "HEY!!!! THIS IS ZUTARA HERE!" and it was so obvious and in-your-face that I can't possibly believe that it was anything but fanservice.
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girlunderglass
Metalbending Cop
Runs With Scissors
Just STFU Already.
Posts: 5,014
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Post by girlunderglass on Sept 20, 2006 20:37:57 GMT -5
Well done Rocio. That was very informative and an interesting read to say the least. Perhaps this is why Zuko has such a fan-base for himself.. maybe we subliminally recognize his character from other roles in different stories.
Karma for a very well thought out post.
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Alleluia
Kyoshi Mai
Earthbending General of the Zutarian Army
Icon by Youkaislayer
Posts: 2,384
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Post by Alleluia on Sept 20, 2006 21:36:59 GMT -5
I am studying for my text of analysis of international narrative structures. And while studied I found a dilemma. Avatar belongs to the narrative classic, is no doubt of it. According to this, the hero is who the camera follows always. But Zuko, being the antagonist, the camera always follows him, and that is very outside the common thing. It is logical that the hero is Aang, but Zuko has incredible characteristics of which in the codes in of the classic narration denominated the hero . Although Aang continues being the hero, Zuko seems to be a second hero. And that is very confused, and it cannot be possible. Because single there is a one only one hero. Then, I prepare my information, and I ask the subject at the senior instructor of the matter, my teacher of the university. And also he seems confused before the happened thing. He said that Zuko, its case, is rare in the classic narrative and one of most attractive. He is the antagonistic heroic. Who is not evil, single he fulfills the duty, with his passion, that makes virtuoso and that makes a hero. But we know, the spectator, that he is not it. Zuko is what the "him-self-man", the man that makes himself . They throw it of its country, deny its inheritance to him, its father rejects him. And even so he follows ahead. Is a character who accompanies the hero, generally. My professor predicts, that in ahead, Zuko and Aang will be allied and/or friends. He was interested very with the character of Zuko, and according to him, he will get to take an adult paper in the gang. That according to my professor Zuko yes or yes it is going to integrate. Believe it or not, the classic narrative is predictable, if one knows to analyze it, but always has surprises in the sense of how the things that one predict happens. As soon as I comments to him about Zutara, he considered it logical. Already He explained to me a very simple code that all classic narrative follows. The hero, Aang in this case, always is enamored with a girl at the beginning of history. But something happens that this relation cannot take shape. And during this acceptance of which the love was not corresponded or it did not work, there is a new girl of whom the hero is fallen in love. My professor knows what he says. He said said it during the class, is part of the code also that the good girl always finishes with the assumption bad boy, that always in the end he turns out not to be so bad. XD So................... About the magazine........... The classic narrative is uindustrial.....The money is very important in it...So...All is possible...... I had a litte bit of trouble understanding what you were saying. But I finally figured it out and I have to tell you that I agree with your professor completely. His analysis of the story of Avatar is exactly what I think, too. This is very cool. Thank you for sharing this. *karma for Rocio*
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Post by rocio on Sept 20, 2006 21:38:41 GMT -5
There is a cause that their ways were often crossed, since apparently, so far, both have been going for the same place. Their ways are parallel. From the characters is unintentional, but for the creators it is very important and in purpose. Zuko is a character very important for the development of Aang. And that is something to which they want to arrive. But everything has a duration and an order, another code in the classic narrative. That it is what history makes plausible. So far we must continue seeing the advances the story and to try to guess that it is what is going to happen. We are the considered public "expectedly". that we have a cognitive or informative advantage with respect to the personage (the hero). We know more than he. The narrator, indeed wants that we try to guess that it will happen. The "Effect of transparency", which is a form to tell, is a technique where everything appears so logical, so natural, that it must be that and it cannot change. Because in a chapter they show Sokka saving a village using its instinct and in another one drugging with cactus juice. It seems illogical that the Sokka of the chapter in which saved the village is drugged himself in another one, thus happened, and seemed totally possible. That is transparency. As aid much in the unfolding of the personages. And of this same form Zuko it is going to join the group and Zutara goes possible. Thanks in order of the transparency. Element that is worth and is the base of the classic narrative. Since this constructs the realism. And this is likely. And therefore, if Zutara happens, although it is in two chapters, is possible. Reason why already I explained. That it is by the same in which is sustained Yue/Sokka and Sokka/Suki (also two chapters, very distant one of the other....). Yes, I'm not already ready for to write long speeches in english and I commit many errors. But is good that you have understood it in the end XD
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Alleluia
Kyoshi Mai
Earthbending General of the Zutarian Army
Icon by Youkaislayer
Posts: 2,384
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Post by Alleluia on Sept 20, 2006 21:56:29 GMT -5
Yes, I'm not already ready for to write long speeches in english and I commit many errors. But is good that you have understood it in the end XD lol Yes, I did understand and that is the important thing. lol You do know that I meant no offense to you, right? I hope you didn't take my previous post as an insult. I didn't mean it as one.
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