kaibasgirl
Ba Sing Se Azula
The Sokkla Addict
Replace ships with fruit and that's exactly what you get.
Posts: 2,772
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Post by kaibasgirl on Sept 11, 2007 22:12:17 GMT -5
That's not good enough for some people. Some people think she has the potential for goodness because she was seen playing a ten-second game of Tag with her brother. Just like some people can't think outside the box. ~Téa
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Maylene
Avatar Roku
Icon by hermonthis from livejournal
Posts: 1,280
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Post by Maylene on Sept 11, 2007 22:13:57 GMT -5
I'm sorry you feel that way, but I don't think it's mean at all. I've seen it used as as argument for her "inherent goodness" too many times to count, when it's clear that her role in the story is of a detestable villain. Really... we're not supposed to like this girl, from a narrative standpoint. We all have our reasons for liking her, but the show coerces us into rooting against her, as demonstrated by her behavior. Of course I feel that way. I feel like that was directed toward me. Besides I never did deny that Azula was a villain--I was just stating that she's not completely "evil" and there are things that I've perceived differently than you (like her constantly stating Fire Nation or her father; while you see that as furthering her, instead of her country and Fire Lord). I won't deny that what she did/does to Zuko (about the Avatar and killing him) was to help him, but instead to save herself. I understood your points, but I was explaining how she could've been redeemed or whatever. I didn't think she would be--I said she could've been. In addition I was also explaining that there were things I saw in Azula, that was human--and not some evil sociopath.
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Post by firenationstooge on Sept 11, 2007 22:16:14 GMT -5
I think one of the main reasons for these "Azula arguments" is because different people are interpreting the same scenes differently.
I.e. One camp says, "Azula spends 10 seconds playing with her brother, but is evil other times. So what?"
While the other says, "Azula is evil most of the time, but even she spent 10 seconds playing with her brother."
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yiceman
Bosco
Not all who wander are lost.
Posts: 2,929
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Post by yiceman on Sept 11, 2007 22:20:16 GMT -5
At that point we have to look towards what the creators themselves say.
The DVD boxset comes out today...I ordered mine on Amazon so I don't have it yet.
Anyone care to give a clear and straightforward quote of exactly what they say about Azula in the CoD commentary?
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Post by Fire Lord Azula on Sept 11, 2007 22:22:58 GMT -5
Just like some people can't think outside the box. ~Téa Cute. So, if the creators keep Azula's character consistent and "soulless", as they themselves said in their Book Two: Volume Four DVD commentary -- read: unsympathetic/irredeemable -- are they unable to think outside the box? Of course I feel that way. I feel like that was directed toward me. Besides I never did deny that Azula was a villain--I was just stating that she's not completely "evil" and there are things that I've perceived differently than you (like her constantly stating Fire Nation or her father; while you see that as furthering her, instead of her country and Fire Lord). I honestly wasn't thinking of you when I typed that. I was recalling a debate I had with MsJimmy before you registered here. In it, she brought up several instances from Zuko Alone in her effort to humanize Azula. The game of Tag was one of her iconic arguments. I assure you, it had nothing to do with you, so please don't take it that way, okay?
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kaibasgirl
Ba Sing Se Azula
The Sokkla Addict
Replace ships with fruit and that's exactly what you get.
Posts: 2,772
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Post by kaibasgirl on Sept 11, 2007 22:43:29 GMT -5
Just like some people can't think outside the box. ~Téa Cute. So, if the creators keep Azula's character consistent and "soulless", as they themselves said in their Book Two: Volume Four DVD commentary -- read: unsympathetic/irredeemable -- are they unable to think outside the box? The writers don't really have anything to do with this, so unless you're going somewhere with it, I don't see why you keep dragging them in. ~Téa
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yiceman
Bosco
Not all who wander are lost.
Posts: 2,929
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Post by yiceman on Sept 11, 2007 22:51:08 GMT -5
Cute. So, if the creators keep Azula's character consistent and "soulless", as they themselves said in their Book Two: Volume Four DVD commentary -- read: unsympathetic/irredeemable -- are they unable to think outside the box? The writers don't really have anything to do with this, so unless you're going somewhere with it, I don't see why you keep dragging them in. ~Téa ...excuse me, but....WHAT? What do you mean they don't have anything to do with this? THEY'RE the ones who decide if she'll be redeemed...and THEY described her as "soulless."
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kaibasgirl
Ba Sing Se Azula
The Sokkla Addict
Replace ships with fruit and that's exactly what you get.
Posts: 2,772
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Post by kaibasgirl on Sept 11, 2007 23:02:13 GMT -5
Sorry, didn't make myself clear.
I meant that the writers don't have anything to do with what we were arguing, so bringing them up was out of place.
~Téa
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Post by grandmaster192 on Sept 11, 2007 23:05:38 GMT -5
General Z', you could have just used my name instead of trying to make me sound like an idiot by posting some people.
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Post by Fire Lord Azula on Sept 11, 2007 23:09:56 GMT -5
Sorry, didn't make myself clear. I meant that the writers don't have anything to do with what we were arguing, so bringing them up was out of place. ~Téa How is it out of place? They direct Azula's actions and motivations. They decided to make her a villain -- and they decide if she'll remain that way. Judging by recent spoilers, it's not a stretch to say she will. General Z', you could have just used my name instead of trying to make me sound like an idiot by posting some people. As I explained to Maylene, I wasn't thinking of either of you.
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SpiritBender
Buzzard Wasp
Ya tvoy hozyayn!!! (May The Force serve you well...)
Posts: 537
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Post by SpiritBender on Sept 11, 2007 23:11:43 GMT -5
That statement makes no sense. The writers are the ones who decide everything that happens in the show! Azula (at least the canon Azula who actually corresponds to the plot of ATLA and not a fan's imagination) only exists as they writers portray her! What the writers say about her is THE deciding factor in all of this, because regardless of how anybody interprets her character, the writers decide what she does and what happens to her! This whole debate about Azula is really a matter of who is interpreting the writers of the show correctly. People need to grow up, stop taking people's comments so personally, and learn how to pay attention to the way the writers portray their characters! When people do that, then this whole debate will become moot, as it should have been in the first place...
-- SpiritBender
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kaibasgirl
Ba Sing Se Azula
The Sokkla Addict
Replace ships with fruit and that's exactly what you get.
Posts: 2,772
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Post by kaibasgirl on Sept 11, 2007 23:20:25 GMT -5
Sorry, didn't make myself clear. I meant that the writers don't have anything to do with what we were arguing, so bringing them up was out of place. ~Téa How is it out of place? They direct Azula's actions and motivations. They decided to make her a villain -- and they decide if she'll remain that way. Judging by recent spoilers, it's not a stretch to say she will. Ah, my mistake then. I thought you meant something different. ^^That statement makes no sense. The writers are the ones who decide everything that happens in the show! Azula (at least the canon Azula who actually corresponds to the plot of ATLA and not a fan's imagination) only exists as they writers portray her! What the writers say about her is THE deciding factor in all of this, because regardless of how anybody interprets her character, the writers decide what she does and what happens to her! This whole debate about Azula is really a matter of who is interpreting the writers of the show correctly. People need to grow up, stop taking people's comments so personally, and learn how to pay attention to the way the writers portray their characters! When people do that, then this whole debate will become moot, as it should have been in the first place... -- SpiritBender Wow...I stand in awe, that was so short and concise, I feel compelled to give you karma for it. ~Téa
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Post by grandmaster192 on Sept 11, 2007 23:26:10 GMT -5
As I explained to Maylene, I wasn't thinking of either of you. So it's MsJimmy you think is an idiot? That really isn't fair... You're a great poster/debater, and I understand that, but it still doesn't give you the right to just discount her opinion like that. MsJimmy should be respected too. Your post was just plain nasty...
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MsJimmy
Refugee Aang
*drok**punk**highfive*
Posts: 4,630
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Post by MsJimmy on Sept 11, 2007 23:32:47 GMT -5
=(
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Post by Fire Lord Azula on Sept 11, 2007 23:34:20 GMT -5
Ah, my mistake then. I thought you meant something different. Oh, okay. No harm done. So it's MsJimmy you think is an idiot? That really isn't fair... You're a great poster/debater, and I understand that, but it still doesn't give you the right to just discount her opinion like that. MsJimmy should be respected too. Your post was just plain nasty... Where are you getting this from? I never said anyone was an idiot. I was responding to and reiterating the comments in this post: But, she does have back story. We've seen her when she was a little girl in Zuko's flashbacks and even back then she was the same as we see her now. I have no idea where you're getting this supposed nastiness from.
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