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Post by dgw2008 on Jul 22, 2008 18:38:44 GMT -5
did the firebend fly up the to the temples when they started the war?
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Horyo
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Post by Horyo on Jul 22, 2008 18:47:59 GMT -5
Seeing as how the comet lasted only so long...and that it appears only masters or very advanced benders can do it...I'd say no, at least the whole army didn't.
I believe they did use the hook-chain technology to hoist their tanks up though, since the Fire Nation had no Air Support.
If anything they could have climbed.
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asian malaysian
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Post by asian malaysian on Jul 23, 2008 4:52:00 GMT -5
Part of me is still wondering why they didnt seem to have buried all their glorious dead in the Southern Air Temple for Aang to find.
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Post by Horyo on Jul 23, 2008 15:34:47 GMT -5
^Not many survivors/supplies maybe?
I think after witnessing the power of the Air Nomads, I'd want to high tail it out rather than clean up and find out there are booby traps. (Not that there are, but in a foreign place, you never know.)
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Post by asian malaysian on Jul 23, 2008 18:26:15 GMT -5
^Not many survivors/supplies maybe? I think after witnessing the power of the Air Nomads, I'd want to high tail it out rather than clean up and find out there are booby traps. (Not that there are, but in a foreign place, you never know.) After a hundred years? At the site of the Firenations's first and most decisive victory? I didnt find the power of the Air Nomads that impressive from what I saw in the series.
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Post by zuko14 on Jul 23, 2008 18:26:34 GMT -5
Seeing as how the comet lasted only so long...and that it appears only masters or very advanced benders can do it...I'd say no, at least the whole army didn't. I believe they did use the hook-chain technology to hoist their tanks up though, since the Fire Nation had no Air Support. If anything they could have climbed. This sounds very good since we have seen it before at the air temple.
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Horyo
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Post by Horyo on Jul 23, 2008 18:29:42 GMT -5
^Not many survivors/supplies maybe? I think after witnessing the power of the Air Nomads, I'd want to high tail it out rather than clean up and find out there are booby traps. (Not that there are, but in a foreign place, you never know.) After a hundred years? At the site of the Firenations's first and most decisive victory? I didnt find the power of the Air Nomads that impressive from what I saw in the series. Who knows what could have happened. We did see alot of dead FN soldiers. Besides, the Air Nomads probably tried to escape and were hunted down by the Fire Nation. It'd be foolish to stay at the site fo an attack.
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asian malaysian
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Post by asian malaysian on Jul 23, 2008 19:44:55 GMT -5
^^ Unlike the Water Tribes and the Earth Kingdom, there is nothing to indicate that there are any remaining Air Nomad strongholds and as far as we know Aang may be the last Air Nomad. I didnt mean set up camp at the air temple. Im talking about burying your dead and setting up a victory flag which is common practice even when "conquering" the North Pole, nevermind sucessfully conquering your enemy's fottress. Actually the only dead FN soldiers we saw were with Gyatso. Katara just found a helmet. Its clear that no one has been to the Souther Air Temple in a hundred years at the site of a battle that must have been celebrated by the Firenation for just as long. It seems very odd.
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Horyo
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Post by Horyo on Jul 23, 2008 20:33:41 GMT -5
I actually meant that the Air Nomads might have flown away since they traveled and had homes elsewhere, leading the FN to track them down.
Maybe they couldn't grow anything. It was pretty cold and snowy and didn't seem like the ideal place for Fire Nation people. Ba Sing Se at least has a field of agriculture.
Though you're right about the flag/overtaking of a fortress. I think it was mainly due to an extermination effort rather than a conquering. The Air Nomads weren't much of a war-mongering race.
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Alleluia
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Post by Alleluia on Jul 24, 2008 8:55:01 GMT -5
Perhaps the FN commanders didn't know there were those troops in that spot, either? In the heat of battle they could have simply lost track of a few soldiers. They presumed them KIA, prolly from being blown off a cliff or something up there, explaining the lack of bodies found. Meanwhile, they had really cornered Gyatso in a hard to reach area of the temple. Or maybe the commanders were scrambling to folow any nomads that ran and just left them behind.
You are assuming that they cared about their dead. Maybe the commander who led the raid on the SAT was a jerk with no honor. Maybe it was Sozin. (Maybe there isn't a difference? :x)
Those soldiers could also have simply been forgotten about b/c the FN had other territory around there to conquer and was trying to do it quickly. Sozin had a limited number of troops. Maybe he had the commanders prioritize and trekking back up a thousand foot mountain to bury a couple people wasn't more important then taking the new territory and establishing bases for future colonies.
Them not going back for the dead seems highly dishonorable to me and against FN character. But then, who knows what caliber of character these guys running the show back then were? Not everyone can be like Zuko, Iroh, or Lt. Jee.
I think either Gyatso and those soldiers were just lost track of/forgot about/abandoned or it was a logic hole so we could have the first view of Aang in the Avatar State.
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Post by asian malaysian on Jul 24, 2008 9:40:09 GMT -5
^^ Its not just Sozin. There have been 2 Firelords since then. We are talking a hundred years. This is a nation that has apparently sustained it self and thrived on military glory since the start of the war. That's at least 3 generations of Fire Nation citizens growing up and learning in school about the glorious victory over the evil Air Nomads , the only element bending group which the Fire Nation truly wiped out (not counting Aang). And no one in the firenation EVER goes back the scene of the Fire Nation's only true undeniable victory? At least just to plant a commerative flag and burying the dead as war heroes? Im not advocating an academy award for "Saving Private Kuzon" or pinning firelillies on everybody's shirt on Sozin's veterans day, but c'mon, doesnt it make sense that the Fire Nation would have used it as an obvious propoganda tool to inspire its citizens to continue supporting a war that seems to never end?
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Horyo
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Post by Horyo on Jul 24, 2008 11:40:03 GMT -5
^But why would the Citizens want to go there? I said in my last post it hosts an unfavorable environment, like the Southern Water Tribes.
You're thinking the FN operates on terms like our modern day countries do, but I think that the FN's troops are too dispersed to even care about past places unless they're occupying a very important area.
Besides, their purpose was to chase Aang wherever he went, not just celebrating the extinction of the Air Nomads.
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Post by asian malaysian on Jul 24, 2008 18:05:43 GMT -5
^^ I take your point that they may not want to live there but even almost a thousand years ago, if you lived in Europe in the times of the Crusades, some of you would make the long difficult trip to Jerusalem after its conquest. Whatever the true purposes of of the leaders of the Fire Nation, basic human nature doesnt change that much. If you lived in a Nation whose government always seemed to be sending its young soldiers to fight and often die in some distant corner of the world as the Firenation did, you would want to make sense of it all to yourself. If you lost friends, siblings, parents or childen to any of those battles, you would want to believe it was for a higher purpose. Zuko said how growing up they were taught that the war was the Firenation's way of sharing its greatness with the rest of the world. They never saw themselves as the bad guys; quite the opposite. They were supposed to be the heroes of the world. To sell this vision of glory and purpose to the ordinary citizens of the Firenation whose sons and daughters have fought in such disastrous battles like the Siege of the North or Ba Sing Se, war propoganda 101 dictates that you must constantly remind them of past glorious achievements on the battlefield. Given real world examples, past and current, what does your gut instincs tell you?
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Post by Horyo on Jul 24, 2008 18:19:23 GMT -5
Well it may also be that the battle was successful, but not proud as great people were probably lost there. The FN's first strike might have been clouded with Civil unrest at that time about the war, but who knows.
Anyways, they just never did come back :X
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Post by asian malaysian on Jul 24, 2008 18:25:35 GMT -5
Well it may also be that the battle was successful, but not proud as great people were probably lost there. The FN's first strike might have been clouded with Civil unrest at that time about the war, but who knows. Anyways, they just never did come back :X ^^ I fully agree that they didnt. I just thought it was odd, is all. Im sorry if I sounded argumentative.
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