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Post by Gran Gran on Mar 31, 2007 22:52:35 GMT -5
nvm... Of course the exterior is the first thing you will notice about the person (in real life), but if you are going to date somebody it stands to reason that there is more to attract you than a hot bod...
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Post by CountessRachel on Apr 1, 2007 0:40:18 GMT -5
...riiiiiight...
Obviously there are other factors. I merely pointed out that most people make their decision of whether or not they want to be with someone initially on looks. It's completely natural. It's how we determine, subconsciously anyway, what any possible future offspring might look like, and I think race plays a big part in that. We want our kids to look like us. They're our kids after all. Aside from that, mixed kids usually have it rougher than most others as far as identity goes, and some people might take that into account when chosing someone they want to spend the rest of their lives with.
But this is about dating. Perhaps I shouldn't jump so far ahead.
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Silver-Angel!
Meng
"Time is a great teacher. To bad it kills all of it's students."
Posts: 253
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Post by Silver-Angel! on Apr 1, 2007 16:04:28 GMT -5
I chose the first one about already dating someone outside my race, because that was the best choice, even though I haven't dated yet. My take on it would be, if you love each other and care about each other, why should race be a problem? Unless they have a racist family... then that would be a problem. I'd probably try to show that family they were wrong about being racist or prejudice.
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Post by Gran Gran on Apr 1, 2007 16:17:26 GMT -5
...riiiiiight... Obviously there are other factors. I merely pointed out that most people make their decision of whether or not they want to be with someone initially on looks. It's completely natural. It's how we determine, subconsciously anyway, what any possible future offspring might look like, and I think race plays a big part in that. We want our kids to look like us. They're our kids after all. Aside from that, mixed kids usually have it rougher than most others as far as identity goes, and some people might take that into account when chosing someone they want to spend the rest of their lives with. But this is about dating. Perhaps I shouldn't jump so far ahead. Why not? Dating is e step in that direction! all good points you brought up! As far as proving the 'in-laws' how stupid prejudism is - good luck! Changing a formed opinion is a tiresome battle, especially if it involves your personal worth. Tilting windmills is easy!
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Post by mike1921 on Apr 1, 2007 23:07:24 GMT -5
Umm.. Sorry if people take into account that there kids won't look like them before dating(unless one of the parent's genes might make the kid a crazy mutant,but as long as there human) I don't honestly think they should be married,let alone dating
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Post by damunch on Apr 1, 2007 23:38:47 GMT -5
Umm.. Sorry if people take into account that there kids won't look like them before dating(unless one of the parent's genes might make the kid a crazy mutant,but as long as there human) I don't honestly think they should be married,let alone dating It's not always a conscious consideration. I've never met anyone who approaches dating with a checklist of pro's and con's but most people do have unconscious preferences which may or may not be logical. Also keep in mind that not only are humans hard-wired to thinking about procreating, we also raise our girls to think about babies (seriously, go to a toy store and count the number of baby dolls in the girls aisle, it's scary). It's only natural for a girl to wonder what her children would look like. And if you do spend any time daydreaming about kids then sometimes it might wind up affecting your choice in partners, conscious or otherwise. Is it good or bad? Neither, the preference for children to look like you can go either way and it's all just human nature anyway.
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Post by CountessRachel on Apr 1, 2007 23:53:49 GMT -5
Almost all parents are going to care what their kids look like. Ever seen when a new baby is born, the parents look at the child and say "Oh he's got your eyes." Or "She has your nose..." etc etc. The whole natural purpose of having babies perpetuates our genes and reassures us that a part of us will live on in the future. Not to mention, we want our kids to be considered attractive because...well, gosh darnit, other people care about looks too. So when our kids get ready to have kids, other people will accept them and they'll have a better chance of makin' babies. So, on the contrary--people who DO care what their kids look like should be the first ones married, let alone dating...
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Post by gothloli on Apr 2, 2007 14:24:43 GMT -5
^^Race does play a crucial role....in the close/narrow minded. To say we want out kids to look like us is a horrible truth but it doesn't have to be accepted. Look at people who adopt orphans or foster children, there are people out there who love their children despite 'who' they look like. To be unable to love a child because they don't share the genes as its mother and/or father is disgraceful and reason the world is so held back. Mixed children have it rough but so does anyone else who has faced any type of discrimination/racism. The bar is not held back just for them. Injustice anywhere is a threat to justice everywhere. And that attractive part is just well hollow But now I don't want you to feel I'm insulting you, this is exactly why I wanted to create this thread, I wanted to see the beliefs and norms that have been accepted in our day and how that plays a role in who we Truthfully and realistically can see ourselves dating. And we are jumping ship too much here this topic is only about dating. Sorry but it had to be addressed.
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Post by damunch on Apr 2, 2007 14:55:41 GMT -5
^^Race does play a crucial role....in the close/narrow minded. To say we want out kids to look like us is a horrible truth but it doesn't have to be accepted. It's very easy to talk about ideals isn't it? Unfortunately real life is far more complex than how the world "should" be. It's better to understand the "horrible truth" than pretending it isn't there. I don't think anyone's mentioned not being able to love a child, though I might have missed that post. What does that have to do with the current discussion? Since when is basic attraction anything but shallow? That's why we have this wonderful thing called conversation, which two people who have a shallow attraction can use to know more important things about each other. Attraction is just the first step, an important but shallow one that we all encounter. Dating does on occaision lead to more serious endeavers, that's kind of the point.
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Post by gothloli on Apr 2, 2007 15:10:48 GMT -5
^^Race does play a crucial role....in the close/narrow minded. To say we want out kids to look like us is a horrible truth but it doesn't have to be accepted. It's very easy to talk about ideals isn't it? Unfortunately real life is far more complex than how the world "should" be. It's better to understand the "horrible truth" than pretending it isn't there. I don't think anyone's mentioned not being able to love a child, though I might have missed that post. What does that have to do with the current discussion? Since when is basic attraction anything but shallow? That's why we have this wonderful thing called conversation, which two people who have a shallow attraction can use to know more important things about each other. Attraction is just the first step, an important but shallow one. Dating does on occaision lead to more serious endeavers, that's kind of the point. *Yes I know what all too well what that reality is, I experienced it first hand so I know it's there. I know it's 'there' but 'it doesn't have to be accepted' **I was interpretting Countessrachel's post as having children that do not 'look' like their mother and/or father will somehow not expand our genes to offspring and such, she stated you would want to have kids that look like you...I'm saying children shouldn't have to look like you, like your skin color, your facial features, your hair texture...whatever. you should be able to love a child if they go outside your race or not... If I am interpretting this wrong please tell me. I don't mean this as a insult....***I never said atrractiveness was shallow/hollow...I was again going back to CR'S post about you would want your children to come out attractive b/c 'other people care about looks too'. YES that's true but that is not the end all to be all, beauty is only skin deep. ****yes, thank you dating does lead to other things, so we can talk freely about that. I just didn't want to go all OT on her post.
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Post by CountessRachel on Apr 2, 2007 15:34:00 GMT -5
Alright, I kinda wanna address your statement about adoption. First of all let me say, I agree in that many people today are close/narrow minded, and that people who adopt interracially and out of other countries is a good thing. But do you know exactly who those foster parents are adopting?
Adoption and Foster Care Analysis and Reporting System reported from 1998-2003 (so this is somewhat recent) that about only 8% of their adoptions were interracial and that 64% of kids waiting to be adopted were minorities while only 36% were white. Of THAT 64%, 51% were black, 11% are Hispanic, 1% Native American, and 1% Asian/Pacific Islander. And that people who usually adopt children are upper class, white, Anglo Saxon families. So in short, people are adopting kids, that, though they don't share their genes, still look like them--racially anyway. Even if they're international children. The number of interracial/international adoptions of minority children in white homes is at best, miniscule. Recently however, there have been an increase white families adopting Asian children and many agencies have stated that the reason the foster parents request Asian children over other children is that Asian children are more accepted by society, they have lighter skin tone, and they will do better in school. So personally, I don't find people who adopt as highly meritable. Meritable yes, but with statistics like that, it's almost the same as having their own child biologically. Just my opinion though.
But really though, who said being unable to love a child that doesn't share the parents' genes is wonderful? I'm saying that it's a natural instinct to want to spread our genes, and through the phenotypes our kids exhibit, it shows an example of a particular species survival.
Part of the racial concern is prejudiced and wrong. I whole-heartedly agree with that. But another part of it is natural instinct, something as living creatures we cannot go against. I mean, no one can truthfully say that they don't care about looks at all. I refuse to believe that a person has no concern whatsoever for the way a person looks unless they're blind. Sure, some people might care about looks more than others. Call me cynical, but in this day and age, a person wants to date another person and will usually factor attractiveness (and often times race) SOMEWHERE in the equation. Shallow? Only if the only thing you like about someone is their looks, then yeah. But that's life.
I agree with you that a wholesome, good person will love a child no matter what he/she looks like. And I'm sure that in the end, most people do. But I'm willing to bet that most parents who biologically have children care to some extent, great or small, that their kids look like them--and I bet they feel some sort of positive feeling when other people tell them so. My mom and dad's friends tell me and my parents, "You look JUST like your mom!" or "You remind me of your dad," and they get very proud when people tell them this.
My point is, that want for our kids to resemble us is natural. Sky is blue, grass is green, most parents want their kids to have similiar features as them. And because I think that's natural, I'm not labeling it as a bad thing.
(And I'm not offended. I just wanted to make sure I expressed my idea clearly. Sometimes I have trouble doing that. ^^;; )
(omg, that was longer than I meant it to be =P)
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Post by damunch on Apr 2, 2007 15:44:50 GMT -5
*Yes I know what all too well what that reality is, I experienced it first hand so I know it's there. I know it's 'there' but 'it doesn't have to be accepted' If we don't accept a thing how then can we change it? Ignoring something doesn't make it go away, isn't it better to be open and frank about something no one likes to admit in an effort to fix it? I believe originally she was talking about the possibility of children unconsciously affecting the decision whether or not to date someone, not the ability to love existing children. Granted I could be wrong but that was my interpretation. Most new parents are only going to consciously care about their child having the right number of parts and being healthy. But it's also the case that no sane expecting parents are going to wish for an ugly baby. People naturally want their kids to be the smart, attractive and happy. It's not callous, it's wanting the best for your child. Most parents will also love whatever comes out regardless. Hm, I seem to have misinterpreted you earlier. If children isn't off topic than what were you referring to before?
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Post by gothloli on Apr 2, 2007 15:51:00 GMT -5
@cr yes, I totally agree most of the times the children that are adopted have parents that also look like them, thank goodness that its not all the time, and I have personally seen that as well. But I do agree with you there.
No no, I don't think beauty can be overlooked but in the end, it rarely matters, but yes, of course the first time you meet someone you might 'first' judge them by how attractive they are. This is human nature/ or habit, and in no way am I debunking this.
Yes, your right it's natural for us to want our children to look like us, to resemble us. I like how you stated that it's something so natural that you don't see it as offending. I didn't think you did before I just wanted to make sure I knew you were saying. thanks girlie...
@d
No what I mean by 'accepted' I mean it doesn't have to be our only choice, we can choose not to conform to what is more easy and comforting...
and yes, I love how CR said its something natural for us to want healthy, attractive kids, she was being frank about it b/c she views as in our nature for us to want it. I was viewing it as something different than that, racially different. Sorry I'm trying to tie everything to race, but I didn't see what she was referring to...
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Post by etherbender on Apr 4, 2007 19:46:07 GMT -5
While I have nothing against interethnical dating, I just prefer girls of my own ethnicity. So no, I can't see myself dating someone of another ethnicity. Then again, I can't see myself dating anyone.
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Post by damunch on Apr 4, 2007 23:21:35 GMT -5
@d No what I mean by 'accepted' I mean it doesn't have to be our only choice, we can choose not to conform to what is more easy and comforting... Ah, I can agree with that
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