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Post by whipwater on Nov 17, 2006 15:11:20 GMT -5
I never said that I was proficient, but you are right, I will make paragraphs. ( I will edit the post.)
I do not expect bear foot and pregnant, quite the contrary. I don't want to see that happen to teens at all. Degraded is far from the intention. I am not a MOF. I am a concerned parent. (33 years old) I do get out, quite a bit, actually. I have traveled all over the world via the United States Air Force, what have you done?
I used to be a Christian, far from the bible belt. I no longer practice, and what would be wrong with that if I were? I do believe that morality doesn't have to be tied to Christianity. Morality can have allot to do with simple good values that come from a good upbringing. Not everyone has to do the right thing because they fear hell. People do the right thing, because it is just that, the right thing. And I hope that in your "committed" high school relationship, you are doing the right thing.
My wife and I just spoke about dating in regards to out daughter. We will not accept a steady boyfriend till she is a senior. It is both our idea that kids try to hard to imitate adult, married coupled behavior in their adolescence. It would be wiser to get to know as many people as possible while in high school. In other words, date allot of different people. Play the field. It gives you a better idea the type you would be happy with for the long term. Most kids once out of high school, go off to college, and high school relationships, and friendships end abruptly. It's easier to deal with the advanced pressures of college, without worrying about a possible long distance relationship.
Yes, it would be grate for Iroh to find a lady friend.
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Power
Fire Lord Zuko
Kataangian Elite. Air/Water Warrior
Toph and Sokka. Every day they get closer to each other.
Posts: 8,513
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Post by Power on Nov 17, 2006 15:12:50 GMT -5
I hope this isnt gettin too out of topic
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Post by whipwater on Nov 17, 2006 15:19:26 GMT -5
Perhaps, but it was merely a reply, and I will try to stay on topic, but teen relationships, is part of this topic. I was merely voicing my opinion. A one sentence post gets you banned on some sites, and that wasn't related to the topic, at all.
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Power
Fire Lord Zuko
Kataangian Elite. Air/Water Warrior
Toph and Sokka. Every day they get closer to each other.
Posts: 8,513
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Post by Power on Nov 17, 2006 15:22:38 GMT -5
i know are stating your opinion, just keep in mind the whole gist of this discussion is the ages in Avatar, not Real Life. That way things dont get overly personal, you feel me?
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Post by whipwater on Nov 17, 2006 15:33:15 GMT -5
Ok, keeping it in the "ages" of avatar. The "kids' in this show, need some adult supervision. LOL. ;D Hopefully, Iroh will become a good father figure for Aang and the gang, seeing that currently there isn't one. Zuko is lucky to have him. If Iroh and Zuko do join the gaang, I think Zutara is likely. After all, her future was told that she would marry a powerful bender. Zuko will become just that. And Iroh will be sure that Zuko treats her right.
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Post by writer on Nov 17, 2006 15:37:09 GMT -5
I never said that I was proficient, but you are right, I will make paragraphs. ( I will edit the post.) I do not expect bear foot and pregnant, quite the contrary. I don't want to see that happen to teens at all. Degraded is far from the intention. I am not a MOF. I am a concerned parent. (33 years old) I do get out, quite a bit, actually. I have traveled all over the world via the United States Air Force, what have you done? I don't get out much in truth because of panic attacks and socialphobias. But I have online relationships from everywhere, from Singapore, Ireland, France and Brazil. I have absorbed diffrents cultures, religions and lifestyles and I have IMO a broader world view. I see not just my culture and morals but twenty others. I can smell it from a mile away, your behavior at "Childrens" cartoon approuch at relashionships carries the aura of a 30-40 something that use to be a regural member of a Baptist church. Morality is diffrent from universal ethics sir. Morals in Avatar are slightly diffrent then the ones here. We shouldn't standarize everything from our world and universe into a psuedo-asiatic one. and Second, my relastionship with my soulmate/boyfriend, is irrelivent to the aguement. I brought it up because it ties into my emotions. I loathe the term, "Play the field." It shakes off the vaules of fidelity and comittment. Which is something we should instil in children, is the value of one person. And the reason kids immated adults, is because that is what they are suppose to do. Kids learn from what they see and so before we can change this generation of kids on proper social morals. Why don't you (as in todays adults) Stop providing them the wrong examples. Good for you an your wife, my mother was a control freak and had the same thoughts, because of that I rebelled and I got into trouble. She didn't prevent it, only instiled it and made me loose confidence I hope your daughter isn't the rebelious type. It's great not grate.
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Post by Werewolf Cookie on Nov 17, 2006 15:49:05 GMT -5
whipwater: The only time I've ever consumed alchohol was when my dad gave me a little champagne on my birthday, and I've never touched pot. In fact I've started avoiding school socials because I agree with you that such things are a sign of immaturity, not maturity, and I think fourteen yuear olds who indulge in those kinds of things are making big mistakes. But I think that if two people are mature enough to remain in a commited relationship without doing anything stupid or getting pregnant or anything, age shouldn't really matter. There are twelve year olds who are mature enough to handle a relationship, and there are eighteen year olds who aren't. I can understand you preventing your daughter from having a relationship until a certain age, because you know how mature she is and how she would cope with a relationship. But you can't always make a blanket rule for an entire age group about whether they are mature enough to date or not. Personally, I think I am mature enough to date, but I don't have much of an interest in dating so I avoid it. Some of my friends who are the same age as me aren't mature enough. I really think that both in real life and in the Ava-verse it should come down to maturity rather than age, unless we're talking solely about sex.
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Post by whipwater on Nov 17, 2006 16:31:09 GMT -5
Broader world view. That's a good one for a teen. You have zero experience. So you know a few people, but you really haven't lived life much. You will though.
I have not once condemned the behavior of the characters in this cartoon. I have questioned why everyone is so interested in an 11 year old and when he is going to kiss someone. I am far from concerned about what this cartoon teaches kids. It's actually a good thing. I thought I was clear, but obviously you have been offended, and I do apologize.
In the context of dating relationships, why do you think fidelity and commitment are so important at your young age? Does your partner own you and do you own your partner? It sounds like you are already married and you are obviously not. Dating and playing marriage are not the same thing. And yes commitment and fidelity are good values. So are loyalty, courage, bravery, self control, self discipline, and self respect. Some of those things teens are quite lacking in. The point I was trying to make is not one of ignoring commitment. Rather just the opposite. Part of being a kid is listening to your parents. It's not easy to do that when you are growing up, but respect none the less, should still be given to your parents. When you become one, you will want respect. Trust me. On top of that, how else will you learn, to truly live with your partner. There is allot of give and take and respect that must be given there too. If you are unable to deal with a controlling mother, how ever will you deal with your partner? There is a commitment to your parents that you are selfishly overlooking. If you respected or honored your "control freak" mother and her feelings, perhaps you would understand. If you were committed to your "control freak" mother instead of your own desires, perhaps you would get it.
I wish I had listened MORE to my parents. They had something that I usually didn't consider. That was experience. Experience is something teens don't understand. The thing is perhaps you should ask your mother her mistakes. Maybe you would have a different perspective on things.
One thing from experience I have learned, is that parents usually want what is best for their kids. MOST do want that. I am not going to say that all parents care, because this is unfortunately, not the case. This is sometimes misconstrued by their kids. I do not know your mother, but maybe you should put yourself in her shoes. Or maybe she is that bad. I know not of her , or you for that matter.
My example is one of a committed, faithful, married man. That is who I am. Saying to play the field, does not in anyway betray that.
So are you the rebellious type? You seem to imply that. Is that something you should be proud of? I also hope my daughter isn't rebellious. What I do I believe is in her best interest. And I do tell her that. I think she trusts me and my wife to that end because we actually do communicate. You make the choice to do what you do , not your mother, it isn't because of her, it's because of you, remember that.
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Post by whipwater on Nov 17, 2006 16:42:07 GMT -5
whipwater: The only time I've ever consumed alchohol was when my dad gave me a little champagne on my birthday, and I've never touched pot. In fact I've started avoiding school socials because I agree with you that such things are a sign of immaturity, not maturity, and I think fourteen yuear olds who indulge in those kinds of things are making big mistakes. But I think that if two people are mature enough to remain in a commited relationship without doing anything stupid or getting pregnant or anything, age shouldn't really matter. There are twelve year olds who are mature enough to handle a relationship, and there are eighteen year olds who aren't. I can understand you preventing your daughter from having a relationship until a certain age, because you know how mature she is and how she would cope with a relationship. But you can't always make a blanket rule for an entire age group about whether they are mature enough to date or not. Personally, I think I am mature enough to date, but I don't have much of an interest in dating so I avoid it. Some of my friends who are the same age as me aren't mature enough. I really think that both in real life and in the Ava-verse it should come down to maturity rather than age, unless we're talking solely about sex. Well, this made me feel better about things. I dissagree that 12 year olds are mature enough to date. Regardless of the culture. I happen to think that it is backwards thinking. You do have to remember , I am 33 yrs old. Maybe when you reach my age, you will remember this silly forum and have a different point view. ;D The Avatar has alot more important things to worry about, like saving the world. Here's one that will blow your mind, all kids today are in his shoes. Our world needs alot of help, what can we do to save it! (I do not mean a religious context either) Politics are corrupt, freedom is being curtailed on every corner, especially in the USA. Thats why I love this cartoon. Me against the world attitude, it's so cool.
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Post by writer on Nov 17, 2006 17:30:28 GMT -5
Broader world view. That's a good one for a teen. You have zero experience. So you know a few people, but you really haven't lived life much. You will though. I have seen too much accually, I perfer a life of hermitage. I have little respect for the human race in general, and only select few will I interact in very personal level. most likely I'll be a recluse like my father. You weren't because of the Paragraphs of Doom << The reaching I preach fiedlity because of the polyamousness in human nature and the fact that divorce rates are inhumanily high. I would love to see a couple that last more than few years before marriage. I would kill to see a 4 year courting period instead of a two month one. dating a mass number off people doesn't tell you much. I have been with several males in a non-sexual relationship. And only..(Lets call him Alen) Alen seems to satifiy me. And during our 3 year break when we have decided to ahem, to borrow your term "Play the field" He found no one that interested him like I did. We dicided that logically we where perfect matches. Since we knew each other, inside and out. And We didn't care about ourselves, just the other person. I think that is something we could teach our kids. Live for our mate's needs instead of ours. I don't own, him. He is free to go anytime, but why? There is nothing out their for him. He said so himself. You think I'm playing marriage, but sir. Marriage is eminent in our furture. The reason we are not wed now, it because it is fool-hardy to do that at such age. I want a steady job and more school before I settle down with "Alen" But we are commited to each other and we are waiting patienctly for the right oppertunity. We listent to our parents, but how can we when they don't know what their talking about sometimes. You talk about courage, self-control and self-respect. Those are good values. But how could you teach them to your daughter? Are you a good example? Or a poor one? You think dating a horde of people is gonna give her wisdom? I doubt it. It never gave me any...but then you're talking to a sociaphobe, with an ASD << Sir? Can I say something? STFU. Don't you dare give me unsolicited advice. That is hypocrtical to what you said below. You don't know about my relastionship with my mother, so I suggest that you butt out. I never ask for parental advice, I just made a satrical comparrison. I should have made it clear thought. True, but her mistakes aren't mine. And I learn from my own, instead of hers. Excatly. My mom does care. But She doesn't even listen to her child, that what frustrates me the most. How can you know if your doing a good job, when you ignore feedback. My mother cannot see through my eyes, and I have hard time understand her. But because of my wired obediace that I was given. I obey her nevertheless, mainly because I hate conflict. She control freak but I let her control me. It's hard to tell, though. Accually my ingrained nature, is complete submission. I will let people put me down and dominate me. And I will not defend myself. Rebellion is something that grew from my mother's control and my want to establish a real identity. Funny, I felt that most of my life my mother made the rules and I just obeyed them. What she wanted for me is unknown. I just hope that her selfishness doesn't bite her in the blubber later. At least you have better communication with your offspring. I wish I had that with my mother like I did with my father. Whom I communicate much better, because of a strong empathic bond
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Post by whipwater on Nov 17, 2006 17:48:26 GMT -5
Quote:When you become one, you will want respect. Trust me. On top of that, how else will you learn, to truly live with your partner. There is allot of give and take and respect that must be given there too. If you are unable to deal with a controlling mother, how ever will you deal with your partner? There is a commitment to your parents that you are selfishly overlooking. If you respected or honored your "control freak" mother and her feelings, perhaps you would understand. If you were committed to your "control freak" mother instead of your own desires, perhaps you would get it.
Oh yeah, it's great, when you don't typo.
Sir? Can I say something? STFU. Don't you dare give me unsolicited advice. That is hypocritical to what you said below. You don't know about my relationship with my mother, so I suggest that you butt out. I never ask for parental advice, I just made a satirical comparison. I should have made it clear thought.
I am sorry , I do not understand STFU, exactly. But anyway, I read all your responses, and in some examples I will agree to disagree. This one however, I am not sure where the unsolicited advice is. Unless it was the ask her what her mistakes were, but you seemed quite adamant about learning from your own mistakes and not hers, but that is the experience I am talking about. But you don't get it, and thats fine. It wasn't meant as advice, more so to help you understand there are other points of view when it comes to parent/child relationships. Where we come from/where you come from(point of view wise). No more no less. It was a pleasure chatting with you, I feel like the horse stopped breathing a while ago.
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Post by Paraiba Ocean on Nov 17, 2006 19:59:01 GMT -5
Even as a teenager in today's modern society, I can tell there's no relevance between what Mr. Whipwater is saying and what the original question. For Mr.Whipwater's topic: I can see that you want to protect your child and raise her properly and you say you feel 16 is the age for dating. I have been forbidden to date until that age from my parents. And I appreciate it. My first relationship was when I was 13 and my boyfriend was 14. I was too young. I feel that middle school relationships are not a good idea, even if the maturity is well placed. There were too many things the two of us were immature enough to handle, especially our break up. The reasons why are personal, but I assure you, I have never smoked, touched drugs, or had sexual intercourse. However, I have been suffocated by my family, and I appreciate their love, but too much will can cause the child to want to rebel even more. I know I have. Several people I know have acted out on occassion, not only for attention, but because they were ignored and quite irritated. Back on topic: Age shouldn't have much to do with a relationship, just so long as it isn't too outrageous (like TophxIroh or something). The Avatar world is very different from our day and age, so we shouldn't compare them to things applying today. The passion and shared feelings between the two should be what matters in a relationship, not our notions of what's too young and too old. Sometimes, I can say that some of the characters are too busy/immature/un-prepared for such a relationship. Zuko is an example. He's immature, mostly self-conceited, and way too absorbed with personal/political matters. There's no way he's ready for a relationship at this point. However, later on, I think he can finally develop and at least make a friend.
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Post by Amira on Nov 17, 2006 20:01:43 GMT -5
This topic needs to get back to Avatar Kids and their ages. The discussion currently being held is more appropriate for the Other General Board and I suggest that if you all want to continue the conversation, move it there.
Now, back to the Avatar Kids and their world and their ages...
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riverbird
Zhao
Flying with the wind
Posts: 812
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Post by riverbird on Nov 19, 2006 16:54:33 GMT -5
I really don't think age should matter when it comes to love. Love is love and you can find the weirdest age differences out there. (Although I don't really agree with really older people dating far younger people) I have seen a married couple that are so in love it is amazing, they are ten years different from each other. I have also seen love with a woman dating a younger man that worked wonders. I do agree that our society seems to push for younger women to older men though. I think it is just the remains of history when 15/16 year old girls would me matched up with older men, it was uncommon for a girl to marry someone that close to her age. I actually dated my childhood friend when I was 14 and he was 12. He was goofy, but also mature when he needed to be. I really loved him and he me. Although at first I was a bit embarrased about dating someone younger than me I got over it and was really happy with him. We only broke up because I moved to Canada and he was in the States, big difference and keeping a long distance relationship, no matter what your age is, is hard.
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