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Post by connoryves on Jun 12, 2007 14:41:01 GMT -5
Can she change? Personally i think she can if she want too. For now i can't really say. There is a part of me who believe there is good. but again probably not.
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SpiritBender
Buzzard Wasp
Ya tvoy hozyayn!!! (May The Force serve you well...)
Posts: 537
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Post by SpiritBender on Jun 12, 2007 14:42:58 GMT -5
^^No. See my posts under Spoilers in Katara kicked Azula's butt.
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Post by spiritmage234 on Jun 12, 2007 14:43:28 GMT -5
No.
Not like she wants to.
Also see my post in Katara kicked Azula's butt. Well, it's more like a definition.
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Post by connoryves on Jun 12, 2007 14:52:36 GMT -5
^^No. See my posts under Spoilers in Katara kicked Azula's butt. Do you think that a little unfair to say that........
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SpiritBender
Buzzard Wasp
Ya tvoy hozyayn!!! (May The Force serve you well...)
Posts: 537
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Post by SpiritBender on Jun 12, 2007 14:53:44 GMT -5
^^No. She's a meglomaniacal sociopath. She's been that way her whole life. She's not capable of seeing any other point of view.
-- SpiritBender
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Post by spiritmage234 on Jun 12, 2007 14:56:03 GMT -5
Maybe in Season Three, we can get some more insight of the orgins of Azula's cruel behavior toward her enemies.
But for the time being, NO.
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Post by Fire Lord Azula on Jun 12, 2007 15:02:29 GMT -5
This again?...
There was a thread on Azula-redemption a few months back. Being that my position on the matter hasn't wavered -- and likely never will -- I'll recycle my previous rebuttal, with a few add-ins.
This character is one that can't be redeemed. To be redeemed, one must honestly want redemption. Azula doesn't! She's perfectly happy with herself as-is. She's arrogant, self-assured, and unapologetic. Hardly a case for redemption.
These redemption scenarios most often come about via fanfiction.
I've read quite a few Azula-redemption fanfics myself. As a whole, I don't care for them. In fanfiction, anything can happen... justification is optional. Azula could build a rocket ship out of fireflakes and soar to the moon if she wanted to, if someone chose to write about it. I think -- though I could be wrong -- many of the people who try to redeem Azula do so for one core reason: they can turn her into what they want her to be. They're not satisfied with who she is -- rather, they use her generalized lack of character-development to turn her into a whole new person. Oftentimes, this is so she can be 'shipped with someone... as she is, Azula can't possibly be finagled into a relationship. Unlike the other main ( and even minor ) characters, she's shown no interest in anyone. So authors do away with her apparent asexuality in order to pair her with someone, and this almost always involves a degree of redemption.
Look at the character in the show itself. She tries to kill people... with a smile on her face, no less!
We won't know 'til Season Three, but Ozai might have more grounds for redemption than Azula. Widely-sited is the fountain scene after Ursa vanished... Ozai seemed forlorn. When we see Azula, she's smirking as always. Someone who takes pleasure in the disappearance -- and possible death -- of her own mother is a hard case to sell.
I believe every move Azula makes has a purpose; an intent behind it, from the writers' standpoint. It's to show us how irredeemably evil she truly is. Why take that away from her? She doesn't need to be like Zuko. I would hate to lose the show's current hallmark villain to redemption; I, as an Azula fan, would rather she die first... and that's saying something.
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Post by connoryves on Jun 12, 2007 15:08:57 GMT -5
^^No. She's a meglomaniacal sociopath. She's been that way her whole life. She's not capable of seeing any other point of view. -- SpiritBender ''meglomaniacal sociopath'' i won't go that far. To me she see just a little spoiler. I remember the creator of the show said that he not interested of making characters all black and all white.
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Post by connoryves on Jun 12, 2007 15:14:28 GMT -5
This again?... There was a thread on Azula-redemption a few months back. Being that my position on the matter hasn't wavered -- and likely never will -- I'll recycle my previous rebuttal, with a few add-ins. This character is one that can't be redeemed. To be redeemed, one must honestly want redemption. Azula doesn't! She's perfectly happy with herself as-is. She's arrogant, self-assured, and unapologetic. Hardly a case for redemption. These redemption scenarios most often come about via fanfiction. I've read quite a few Azula-redemption fanfics myself. As a whole, I don't care for them. In fanfiction, anything can happen... justification is optional. Azula could build a rocket ship out of fireflakes and soar to the moon if she wanted to, if someone chose to write about it. I think -- though I could be wrong -- many of the people who try to redeem Azula do so for one core reason: they can turn her into what they want her to be. They're not satisfied with who she is -- rather, they use her generalized lack of character-development to turn her into a whole new person. Oftentimes, this is so she can be 'shipped with someone... as she is, Azula can't possibly be finagled into a relationship. Unlike the other main ( and even minor ) characters, she's shown no interest in anyone. So authors do away with her apparent asexuality in order to pair her with someone, and this almost always involves a degree of redemption. Look at the character in the show itself. She tries to kill people... with a smile on her face, no less!We won't know 'til Season Three, but Ozai might have more grounds for redemption than Azula. Widely-sited is the fountain scene after Ursa vanished... Ozai seemed forlorn. When we see Azula, she's smirking as always. Someone who takes pleasure in the disappearance -- and possible death -- of her own mother is a hard case to sell. I believe every move Azula makes has a purpose; an intent behind it, from the writers' standpoint. It's to show us how irredeemably evil she truly is. Why take that away from her? She doesn't need to be like Zuko. I would hate to lose the show's current hallmark villain to redemption; I, as an Azula fan, would rather she die first... and that's saying something. Wow, wait a second ! I never said that want Azula to be like her brother...but you did make a good point.
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Post by spiritmage234 on Jun 12, 2007 15:24:50 GMT -5
^^No. She's a meglomaniacal sociopath. She's been that way her whole life. She's not capable of seeing any other point of view. -- SpiritBender ''meglomaniacal sociopath'' i won't go that far. To me she see just a little spoiler. I remember the creator of the show said that he not interested of making characters all black and all white. Well, not a meglomaniacal sociopath, more like a plan sociopath. Just the part with her firing a bolt of lightning at Aang with the intent to kill probably fully aware that if she killed the Avatar she'd hafta to start the whole search all over again. But then I just remembered that she planned on killing him in the Avatar State, soooooooooooooooooooo disregard what I just said. >_>
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Post by Fire Lord Azula on Jun 12, 2007 15:29:38 GMT -5
connoryves: If Azula winds up atoning for her past transgressions, she will be like Zuko, whose redemption has been all but assured. I appreciate your compliment, though -- thanks! @the Spirit Mage: But Azula is megalomaniacal. I doubt she'd care if she had to restart the search for the Avatar... if he'd be reincarnated at all ( being that he died in the Avatar State ), he'd be reborn in the Water Tribes. An infant isn't going to pose a threat, and, by the time the new Avatar would become an obstacle, the Fire Nation would have annexed every last corner of the world.
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Post by spiritmage234 on Jun 12, 2007 15:32:39 GMT -5
connoryves: If Azula winds up atoning for her past transgressions, she will be like Zuko, whose redemption has been all but assured. I appreciate your compliment, though -- thanks! @the Spirit Mage: But Azula is megalomaniacal. I doubt she'd care if she had to restart the search for the Avatar... if he'd be reincarnated at all ( being that he died in the Avatar State ), he'd be reborn in the Water Tribes. An infant isn't going to pose a threat, and, by the time the new Avatar would become an obstacle, the Fire Nation would have annexed every last corner of the world. ^...That is also very true. *nods* And I doubted that Ozai would get mad at his lil' princess for killing the Avatar. *nods more intently*
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Post by connoryves on Jun 12, 2007 15:40:08 GMT -5
''meglomaniacal sociopath'' i won't go that far. To me she see just a little spoiler. I remember the creator of the show said that he not interested of making characters all black and all white. Well, not a meglomaniacal sociopath, more like a plan sociopath. Just the part with her firing a bolt of lightning at Aang with the intent to kill probably fully aware that if she killed the Avatar she'd hafta to start the whole search all over again. But then I just remembered that she planned on killing him in the Avatar State, soooooooooooooooooooo disregard what I just said. >_> people give her to much credit, i don't think that Azula knew about the Avatar State since i don't think fire sages knew about it
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Post by spiritmage234 on Jun 12, 2007 15:59:00 GMT -5
We may never know what Azula knows in the crazy little thing that she might call a mind........
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yiceman
Bosco
Not all who wander are lost.
Posts: 2,929
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Post by yiceman on Jun 12, 2007 17:26:24 GMT -5
No.
Whenever this question is asked, I am forced to remind people of this: She has thus far already attempted to murder three people, and succeeded once.
She shot lightning at Zuko in the Avatar State at point-blank range.
She shot Iroh when he wasn't looking.
She shot Aang in the back, with a big fat smile on her face.
Three main character's she's actually attempted to maliciously murder. Not even Zhao had those marks against him. In real life, forgiveness can be offered to anyone who wishes to change, but it's different in a story. After attempting to kill three major characters and succeeding in killing the MAIN character, there's no act that she could do for redemption that would make any lick of sense at all.
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