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Post by spirityue on Mar 15, 2008 16:59:42 GMT -5
night, But why even stoop to that level? Like I said, if pm'ing doesn't work, than why not simply choose to be the better person by letting it drop? @skye, Very well stated! Of course not everyone is going to agree with everyone else's opinions, I'm giving you karma for speaking your mind! (if that doesn't interfere with someone elses opinion )
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Post by night on Mar 15, 2008 17:17:12 GMT -5
But if the person is constantly persistent, then smiting is a way to get to them.
Back to my original argument, karma is just a number, I don't see why people fret so much if they are docked a few points. They will most likely gain it back, eventually.
I remember this code that made people PM whoever they exalted/smited and allow them to explain why they performed whichever action. Pity that it is so easy to bypass by hitting the back button...
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girlunderglass
Metalbending Cop
Runs With Scissors
Just STFU Already.
Posts: 5,014
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Post by girlunderglass on Mar 15, 2008 17:22:22 GMT -5
I think the point is being missed here. If smiting someone is a personal preference and karma is just a number, how come the same people are being caught doing it sneakily behind a person's back?
The smite feature was removed initially because people were abusing it. Just like you tell a person "good point- karma for you", some people feel the need to smite a person and not give their reason.
Going behind everyone's back and smiting after the feature has been removed is flat out sneaky and dishonest. Had it been anyone else losing their Karma, they would not have been happy either.
As for the duplicate accounts, it has been noted that a few people where making alternate accounts just to exalt themselves. So if karma is just a number, why the need to go to the extreme to exalt one's self?
It's a good rule to put in effect. I see no reason for anyone to be upset over this. It keeps everyone honest.
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Post by Amira on Mar 15, 2008 17:23:51 GMT -5
Smiting does nothing. It doesn't tell you why someone is upset with you. It doesn't tell you what you did. All it says is that someone would rather namelessly and facelessly take away a karma point rather than confront directly. And if someone has a problem with someone and they PM that person and get no response, well then PM a staff member and explain the problem.
There is no justifiable excuse for smiting because there are plenty of other avenues that bring the problem to light where it can be discussed and a solution worked out.
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Post by Musogato on Mar 15, 2008 17:26:29 GMT -5
Yes, karma is just a number, but wouldn't people be equally upset if we just decided to make everyone's karma level stay at a nice happy 100? Or just got rid of it all together? The problem with the smiting is that people are abusing it. We can't help it if certain browsers or proxies don't use the smite-hiding code, but that doesn't mean we should allow its use just because some people have access to it. Just like we shouldn't allow people to get away with grouping together to smite specific people. It may just be a number, but abuse is abuse, and there are better ways to deal with our problems.
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Post by night on Mar 15, 2008 17:31:03 GMT -5
GUG, if you are referring to me smiting, that was a while ago, and I have not done it since people have been caught. Check the log if you need reassurance.
I agree that karmaing oneself is outright stupid. That clearly shows that the person in question takes karma too seriously. Though, if you are referring to my alter usage, that was a year ago. They have not been active since. Again, check the log.
I apologize if I seem to have taken this too personally, though it seemed that your post was directed at my comments.
Just a note though, whenever I use a proxy to check DH at school, the smite button is visible. Perhaps some people use a proxy regularly and assume that the smite button is visible?
Pity that the coding that I mentioned in my previous post is too easy to exploit. It would have been a wonderful way to stay honest while still being able to both exalt and smite.
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Post by spirityue on Mar 15, 2008 17:32:14 GMT -5
I would just like to offer a word of thanks to Girlunderglass, Amira, and Musogato, for effortlessly stating the point I was trying to make but couldn't seem to find the right combination of words at the time. So again, Thanks!
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Post by Blind Bandit on Mar 15, 2008 17:35:25 GMT -5
Night no one is pointing fingers here. This is simply making a formal rule in accordance with the staff's feelings about the issue, while taking into account the issues smiting has caused.
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Post by username on Mar 15, 2008 17:37:26 GMT -5
Sorry Night, cant help you out much here.
karma going down = someones unhappy with you = someones feelings might get hurt
You might as well just PM if your unhappy.
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Post by night on Mar 15, 2008 17:41:57 GMT -5
Back to my main argument again, people should not get so worked up if their karma goes down.
It reflects your popularity. If it goes down, then someone is obviously unhappy.
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Post by username on Mar 15, 2008 17:48:17 GMT -5
Yah. But if you want to let someone know your unhappy you can just tell them. That way they know who is unhappy, and why. And it comes across as less (for lack of a better word) "sneaky."
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Post by Musogato on Mar 15, 2008 17:52:01 GMT -5
Yes, but the problem is that for the general forum smiting is anonymous. The people being smited don't know who's doing it, when it's happening, or why. All they know is that someone obviously has a problem with them. Whereas if people just pm'ed each other explaining their dissatisfaction, they would know exactly what the problem is. And if it's a serious issue that the would-be smiters feel isn't being improved, then they should bring it to a staff member. And if things are still not working then it should be brought to another staff member, or even directly to me. All smiting does is put people on the defensive, and that's hardly helpful in solving problems.
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Post by night on Mar 15, 2008 18:04:22 GMT -5
Too bad that part of the log isn't accessible to the public...
I do understand your approach, but why make such a big deal about? As in, why are there such punishments for simply smiting? To force people to take your approach? As far as I know, the smiting fiasco seems to have calmed down by now, so perhaps you could wait and see if mass-smitings occurred again before enforcing this?
It seems that I am fighting a loosing argument here, if it is even considered that. Quite honestly, the bottom line is, that I don't feel that karma should be taken so seriously around here. Again, I reiterate, it is just a number.
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Post by username on Mar 15, 2008 18:08:22 GMT -5
I agree it shouldnt be taken so seriously. It should be considered "improper," and you can do the reverse smite thing if you want, but any serious punishment seems unnecesary.
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Post by Musogato on Mar 15, 2008 18:14:11 GMT -5
Screenshots of the smiting *could* be posted for public viewing, however the staff felt that doing that would just create more problems and unnecessary wangst. In any case, we're doing this now because of the recent mass-smitings and because our stance on it should have been known from the beginning. Waiting until "next time" would just delay solving the problem, maybe even more so since the smiters would be aware that we know who's doing it.
As for the severe punishments, that's just for those who abuse it. Most offenses on this forum that go under abuse are met with a ban of some sort. Number or not, people on this forum shouldn't have to feel like they're being ganged up on.
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