kaibasgirl
Ba Sing Se Azula
The Sokkla Addict
Replace ships with fruit and that's exactly what you get.
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Post by kaibasgirl on Dec 21, 2007 3:18:54 GMT -5
hm...I think it was more because of Roku's friendship with Sozin, but you have a point ^^
this kind of reminds me of HP, where Dumbledor pushed aside fighting Gridlewald for five years for selfish reasons.
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pg15
Avatar Roku
"Since beginningless time, darkness thrives in the void, but always yields to purifying light."
Posts: 1,248
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Post by pg15 on Dec 21, 2007 3:22:18 GMT -5
Sozin only started his war plans after Roku died; Roku had nothing to ignore in choosing a peaceful life on his island (which was pretty close to the Fire Nation shores anyway).
As for the Avatar State, well, like I said, it is powerful, but it's also ridiculously dangerous. If Ozai gets in one lucky shot...
Aang needs to master the 4 elements, and I really mean MASTER them. Chasing after the Avatar State is not what he should be doing right now. It's too dangerous.
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Post by mahatista on Dec 21, 2007 3:26:56 GMT -5
I am reading more HP references lately. In fact someone just posted their fear of an epilogue in reference to Rowling. Maybe I should read the darn things or see the darn movies so I can follow the conversation. RE: Roku, it really just occurred to me so I haven't thought it out. I did think it stood out when Roku said he'd stayed at his home most of the time. Seems like he should be visiting the other nations at least once a year. I know it's not easy, but he did have a dragon on which to fly. And at the end it seemed he and Sozin weren't really friends anymore. They had sort of split and Roku was surprised when Sozin came to help him at the volcano. I don't know. Was Roku hampered by earthly attachments? EDIT: I just saw the above post and I realize Sozin didn't actively start his nefarious plots until after Roku died, but there was more to do than that. I'm just sayin', even Roku admits he screwed up - I'm just musing on the 'root cause' of the screw-up. EDITx2: Ugh! This is so unclear. I realize Sozin didn't start the war until after Roku died. He was most likely plotting from the time he got the massive wedgie until he helped Roku to 'meet his reward.'
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Post by marvel26 on Dec 21, 2007 3:27:16 GMT -5
Sozin only started his war plans after Roku died; Roku had nothing to ignore in choosing a peaceful life on his island (which was pretty close to the Fire Nation shores anyway). As for the Avatar State, well, like I said, it is powerful, but it's also ridiculously dangerous. If Ozai gets in one lucky shot... Aang needs to master the 4 elements, and I really mean MASTER them. Chasing after the Avatar State is not what he should be doing right now. It's too dangerous. Hence why Aang needs better control over the Avatar state. So far what we've seen of him in that state is him stationary while things go boom. Yes, he's a sitting duck that way. I'm sure he's supposed to move around while in that state, if he had a clear mind. Souzin started his expansionistic plans long before Roku kicked the bucket. Roku confronted him about it remember? Souzin simply held off grabbing more land till after his 'best friend' died. Roku must have thought his words got through and Souzin was still his friend at heart. We all know that was a big mistake. @mahatista: Roku wasn't hampered by earthly attachments: he went into the Avatar state trying to beat the volcano. His eyes went all disco in that episode remember? If anything he's guilty off is putting his faith in Souzin. Souzin's not an earthly attachment, more along the lines of, "He's my friend. He wouldn't hurt me." Once again...wrong.
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pg15
Avatar Roku
"Since beginningless time, darkness thrives in the void, but always yields to purifying light."
Posts: 1,248
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Post by pg15 on Dec 21, 2007 3:31:43 GMT -5
I am reading more HP references lately. In fact someone just posted their fear of an epilogue in reference to Rowling. Maybe I should read the darn things or see the darn movies so I can follow the conversation. RE: Roku, it really just occurred to me so I haven't thought it out. I did think it stood out when Roku said he'd stayed at his home most of the time. Seems like he should be visiting the other nations at least once a year. I know it's not easy, but he did have a dragon on which to fly. And at the end it seemed he and Sozin weren't really friends anymore. They had sort of split and Roku was surprised when Sozin came to help him at the volcano. I don't know. Was Roku hampered by earthly attachments? Well, considering he's said "most of the time", it must mean he was NOT there some of the time, right? Must've been galavanting around the world during those times. Souzin started his expansionistic plans long before Roku kicked the bucket. Roku confronted him about it remember? Souzin simply held off grabbing more land till after his 'best friend' died. Roku must have thought his words got through and Souzin was still his friend at heart. We all know that was a big mistake. Of course I remembered that. However, as I said, Sozin didn't do any more stuff, so what was Roku to do? Purposely waylay the Fire Nation's army just because it may cause a threat? I certainly hope Roku wasn't like Dubya.
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Post by mahatista on Dec 21, 2007 3:35:59 GMT -5
I made an edit to my earlier post, and I believe that Roku admitted he'd screwed up. And I think it had to do with the war. I'll have to go back to the transcript (if it's on ASN) of The Awakening, but I think it was there.
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kaibasgirl
Ba Sing Se Azula
The Sokkla Addict
Replace ships with fruit and that's exactly what you get.
Posts: 2,772
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Post by kaibasgirl on Dec 21, 2007 3:37:48 GMT -5
mahatista, whatever you do, don't watch the movies. They suck majorly. Read the books, I'm telling you, you won't be disappointed. either way, mastering the four elements isn't going to help Aang all that much against Ozai. The guy can bend lightning as fast as he blinks, he's going to need all the help he can get, and that includes the Avatar State. Besides, Aang's died before and he came back to life, all we need to do is make sure Katara's got some magic water on her (I'm kidding on that last part, btw) Oh, and just to add, Aang's the last Airbender, and the main character, and everyone knows the main character doesn't die.
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Post by marvel26 on Dec 21, 2007 3:37:49 GMT -5
I am reading more HP references lately. In fact someone just posted their fear of an epilogue in reference to Rowling. Maybe I should read the darn things or see the darn movies so I can follow the conversation. RE: Roku, it really just occurred to me so I haven't thought it out. I did think it stood out when Roku said he'd stayed at his home most of the time. Seems like he should be visiting the other nations at least once a year. I know it's not easy, but he did have a dragon on which to fly. And at the end it seemed he and Sozin weren't really friends anymore. They had sort of split and Roku was surprised when Sozin came to help him at the volcano. I don't know. Was Roku hampered by earthly attachments? Well, considering he's said "most of the time", it must mean he was NOT there some of the time, right? Must've been galavanting around the world during those times. Souzin started his expansionistic plans long before Roku kicked the bucket. Roku confronted him about it remember? Souzin simply held off grabbing more land till after his 'best friend' died. Roku must have thought his words got through and Souzin was still his friend at heart. We all know that was a big mistake. Of course I remembered that. However, as I said, Sozin didn't do any more stuff, so what was Roku to do? Purposely waylay the Fire Nation's army just because it may cause a threat? I certainly hope Roku wasn't like Dubya. Souzin's mind must have been going, "Well, can't do anything while HE'S still kicking. And it's suicide to kill him. But can I really do that to my friend?" He did show some signs of still caring while he was watching Roku's island burn from his balcony. He even helped Roku. But when Roku stumbled... "Now's your chance! Let him die! No one can stop you now!" And he took it. As for what Roku could have done. He could have done plenty...if he knew about it. What I'm trying to say is that Roku DIDN'T take action because he felt no need to. "Souzin learned his lesson when I gave him an earth wedgie, let's leave it at that." Souzin could have been stockpiling arms and supplies in secret and Roku'd never know.
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Post by mahatista on Dec 21, 2007 3:39:23 GMT -5
Here it is. Roku says this to Aang in The Awakening (via ASN): Aang: Roku? Roku: You haven't failed, Aang. Aang: But everyone thinks I am dead again. They think I've abandoned them, and I'm losing this war. I'm letting the whole world down. Roku: If anyone is to blame for the state of the world, it is me. I should've seen this war coming, and prevented it. You inherited my problems and my mistakes. But I also believe you are destined to redeem me, and save the world. Aang: I don't know. --- Earthly attachments? --- EDIT: Thanks for the HP advice Kai. I've only seen the first movie and that's probably why that's the only experience I've had with the franchise. I know enough people who are crazy about the books though to be interested.
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pg15
Avatar Roku
"Since beginningless time, darkness thrives in the void, but always yields to purifying light."
Posts: 1,248
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Post by pg15 on Dec 21, 2007 3:41:26 GMT -5
If he was able to attain the Avatar State, then by default he wouldn't have Earthly attachments now, would he?
Would he?
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kaibasgirl
Ba Sing Se Azula
The Sokkla Addict
Replace ships with fruit and that's exactly what you get.
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Post by kaibasgirl on Dec 21, 2007 3:42:20 GMT -5
Most likely his feelings for his friend blinded him. After all, I don't think it ever crossed his mind that Sozin would betray him/wouldn't listen to him. He set too much store on their past friendship.
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Post by mahatista on Dec 21, 2007 3:44:09 GMT -5
If he was able to attain the Avatar State, then by default he wouldn't have Earthly attachments now, would he? Would he? Aggressive questioning! Intriguing. He did say he screwed up. He did say he should have seen the war coming. Why didn't he see it coming? Because he was on the farm with the wifey all the time.
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kaibasgirl
Ba Sing Se Azula
The Sokkla Addict
Replace ships with fruit and that's exactly what you get.
Posts: 2,772
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Post by kaibasgirl on Dec 21, 2007 3:48:29 GMT -5
You're welcome mahatista ^^
hm...I think it was more his friendship with Sozin that blinded him. Maybe he didn't want to admit his friend has changed so much?
Though, I think it was pretty stupid of him to try and stop the volcano, especially when they all got off the island safely, and he saw that even in the Avatar State he couldn't stop it.
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pg15
Avatar Roku
"Since beginningless time, darkness thrives in the void, but always yields to purifying light."
Posts: 1,248
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Post by pg15 on Dec 21, 2007 3:48:38 GMT -5
Actually, I was leaning more towards unsure-ness with the extra "would he?" (the tone didn't come out right). ;D
I'd go with Sozin = mastermind of hiding stuff, actually. Roku was good, just not good enough. I don't think it had anything with Ta Min. If there is one lesson Avatar teaches, is that the human element is very important, and with that comes love, friendship, and happiness; the artificial, cold, inhuman Cosmic Power is often seen in a negative light.
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kaibasgirl
Ba Sing Se Azula
The Sokkla Addict
Replace ships with fruit and that's exactly what you get.
Posts: 2,772
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Post by kaibasgirl on Dec 21, 2007 3:51:01 GMT -5
True, but it has to be taken in moderation. The Avatar has to remember that the world comes first, there personal life second.
Spoilers removed.
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