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Post by Gran Gran on Jul 26, 2008 15:42:20 GMT -5
Afghanistan is one thing, but we invaded a country--illegally--under false pretenses and overthrew its government. That's a fact. The war wasn't illegal, it was approved by Congress, after the President proposed it. That's how it's supposed to go. Oh, and, if anyone brings up the U.N., the Security Council should not be able to decide who it is can and can't go to war. Our country should be able to decide what it want s to do without a union of countries, many opposing America and its viewpoints, giving us the go-ahead. Oh, and, it wasn't exactly false pretenses, it was mistaken pretenses if you will, false pretenses implies a direct and deliberate lie. And I don't care either if we overthrew a madman, genocidal, warmongering despot. Really, I don't. Well....more illegal things have happened since then, let's say unconstitutional. The UN was formed to prevent disaster like WWI and II and prevent the total distruction of the planet by nuklear means. Because when 2 tribes go to war other countries get affected by it, it's as simple as that.
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Post by Grimmjow of the Funk on Jul 26, 2008 23:26:27 GMT -5
Afghanistan is one thing, but we invaded a country--illegally--under false pretenses and overthrew its government. That's a fact. The war wasn't illegal, it was approved by Congress, after the President proposed it. That's how it's supposed to go. Oh, and, if anyone brings up the U.N., the Security Council should not be able to decide who it is can and can't go to war. Our country should be able to decide what it want s to do without a union of countries, many opposing America and its viewpoints, giving us the go-ahead. Oh, and, it wasn't exactly false pretenses, it was mistaken pretenses if you will, false pretenses implies a direct and deliberate lie. And I don't care either if we overthrew a madman, genocidal, warmongering despot. Really, I don't. based on your definition of false pretenses i still think that is the correct wording and even if it was mistaken it was a really big mistake. we basically went to war for no reason. yet bush is still are president. in any country wit ha right mind a leader that makes a mistake like that should be immediately dethroned but in our screwed up nation we re-elect him. thats why we should be taking steps to leave the middle east all together. i liked the idea of going into afghanistan and Obama agrees that that war was justifiable. now McCain wants to not only stay in iraq but go to iran? not only is that ludicrous but do we even have the military strength to accomplish such a feat seeing as we are having problems in iraq right now. McCain votes the same as bush in 95% on the issues its almost like having a carbon copy of bush but older.
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Post by CountessRachel on Jul 27, 2008 2:43:12 GMT -5
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historyman12
Fugitive Iroh
IS IT JULY 14TH YET?
Posts: 4,822
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Post by historyman12 on Jul 27, 2008 9:43:35 GMT -5
I'm on the "Irrelevant" side. After all, he can still, you know, read. And people probably know how to, you know, write and print out something used on the computer. McCain's computer skills are as relevant as Obama's flag pin. Negatively relevant.
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Post by Princess Azula on Jul 28, 2008 4:16:39 GMT -5
Mildly distressing, but not too important. I'd be more concerned about legislators who are ignorant about computers and seek to pass laws about them regardless. Ted Stevens, we're looking at you.
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Post by mikael on Jul 28, 2008 19:54:06 GMT -5
On a side note, Congress never approved a war. They approved the President's request to use military action for longer than 90 days. We haven't had an actual war (i.e. declared by Congress) since WW2.
There's no way McCain is a safe vote. Despite his credentials, anything positive he can bring, he is backed by a party that manipulated the American people for the past 8 years for what almost certainly amounts to personal gain.
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Post by kolibri [thread killer] on Jul 30, 2008 9:34:27 GMT -5
Obama. I agree with most of what he says. I am neutral on abortion, so I'm not even going to get into that.
Now, onto another reason why I support Obama. This is going to sound stupid, but I also base my choice on how they handle themselves.
I've talked to our state senator about what he thinks when he came ot our school. He said he knew both of them personally and Obama would be his choice based on how they handle things. Obama is more calm about things and McCain has a quick temper. I would agree. McCain doesn't seem the type to remain calm in a situation and comes across me as the type who would blow up. Temperament, to me, is an important asset. They represent our country. If we have a president with a quick temper and stumbles over himself in speeches, what image is that going to send to the world? If someone says something to him at a meeting with other world leaders? I'm not entirely comfortable with that thought.
There are some in American who are going "But, But, but we CAN'T have a black president! It's not -insert comments that can be interpreted as racist-" My answer to them: Get over it. I was listening to a radio interview with someone from Germany, I forget who, but they were talking about Obama's visit to Germany and there was a comment in there about how Germany finds it hilarious that some Americans don't want a black president.
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Post by Grimmjow of the Funk on Jul 30, 2008 10:06:37 GMT -5
that is a good point. and in talking about views of our nation, the bush administration really hurt that in they way they've handled things with foreign policy. based on the McCain is talking about iraq in Iran i doubt that view will cahnge if he is elected president. think about how when Bush visits countries there is alot of protest but when Obama visited Germany there was a huge crowd cheering for him. that hasn't happened since the Clinton administration.
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Post by Munchkinator on Jul 30, 2008 23:15:35 GMT -5
"OH NOES, OBAMA IS BLACK"
Seriously, as Kolibri stated, people need to get over that fact. What the hell is wrong with people these days? --; Honestly, I haven't paid much attention to what each candidate stands for/against. So, my choice is not for the individual person, but for the party they represent. With that said, I'd go for Obama, seeing as I favor the democratic party.
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Post by CountessRachel on Jul 31, 2008 0:12:10 GMT -5
I don't find it hilarious, I find it sad, that people factor in the melanin cell levels in a person's ability to perform leadership tasks.
Overall though, and I think someone touched on this subject earlier, I do NOT consider Obama black and if he were to win the presidential election, he would NOT be the first black president--he'd be the first MIXED president as he is of MIXED parentage. Not trying to be PC, not trying to be technical. I'm just calling it what I see it. People need to end this one-drop mentality because all it does is perpetuate an outdated mindset drenched with underlying racism and exclusive behavior.
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Post by Grimmjow of the Funk on Jul 31, 2008 0:15:16 GMT -5
Whats really pissing me off are the endless McCain ads bashing Obama anytime i access this thread does anyone else notice that.
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asian malaysian
Avatar Kyoshi
Let me hear you say this ship is bananas! B-A-NA-N-A-S!
Posts: 1,308
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Post by asian malaysian on Jul 31, 2008 1:10:08 GMT -5
^^ I think its quite telling about the strength of McCain's candidacy that the McCain team is focusing on trying to convince people to vote against Obama rather than in favour of McCain. CountessRachel-Apparently, Jesse Jackson isnt convinced that he's black either.
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fuego
Pabu
Four Nation Health Care
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Post by fuego on Jul 31, 2008 5:46:18 GMT -5
I love both of these guys but it seem one of them is in control of there party and the other is being control by there party.
It all about the message
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Post by Grimmjow of the Funk on Jul 31, 2008 8:06:26 GMT -5
^^ I think its quite telling about the strength of McCain's candidacy that the McCain team is focusing on trying to convince people to vote against Obama rather than in favour of McCain. CountessRachel-Apparently, Jesse Jackson isnt convinced that he's black either. well that is what the republican party is good for
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Post by kolibri [thread killer] on Jul 31, 2008 16:05:59 GMT -5
Whats really pissing me off are the endless McCain ads bashing Obama anytime i access this thread does anyone else notice that. Agreed. It's really Childish if you think about it. McCain needs to be promoting himself if he's even going to have a chance. People don't care what he's blaming Obama for, they're more interested in what he stands for. But I admit, it's really hard to sit through his speeches with his monotone.
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