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Post by WyrmKing on Nov 25, 2007 16:32:19 GMT -5
I'm not saying that illegal immigrants should be allowed to vote. However, it's not by any random circumstance that they're showing up on our doorstep. Well it was originally their doorstep and we like stole it from them.
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Post by casettejongen on Nov 25, 2007 16:43:50 GMT -5
they're illegal because A: They can't speak english(doesn't apply to all illegal immigrants, I'm pretty sure some countries other than America speak English) B: They take jobs away from legal Americans C: They might be terrorists. They can't vote beause A: They might of came to spread the crazy morals of their countries and that's more then enough for me. A: Give people the chance and time... B: I'm not certain about America, but in Belgium, it has been proven that we NEED immigrants, because we do not have enough Belgians for the jos needed... C: Yeah, and all Japanese are karatemasters, and all Belgians are fries-eating morones, and Dutchmen make cheese and mills. That's racism Mike . A: You mean like the Americans do, but then with armed force? I mean, last time I checked, America had such wicked morals that even you didn't agree with them. So Spirit Mage, you say that they should just stay where they are and try to do something? Easy saying when you live in the USA, but for people who have nothing, it's a bit more difficult. One last thing, WyrmKing, it's not hard applying for citizenship, it's unbelievably difficult to get it.
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Post by lunachaos on Nov 25, 2007 17:26:08 GMT -5
Whoa, I just wrote a paper for this topic. Well, not about voting, but about illegal immigrants and how we should keep them or get rid of them. ;0; Anyways, did you guys know there's like 12 million illegal immigrants in the U.S.? That could sway the vote hugely. No way should they be able to vote. They're not citizens. That's like having people in Russia getting the opportunity to vote. They're not citizens. I know it's a little different for aliens living in the U.S., but it's the same concept. Mike: Whoa....that's a bold post. A: Most immigrants can speak English. And that really has nothing to do with whether they're illegal or not. I'm sure some legal immigrants have trouble with English. B: No way. They don't take jobs away, they fill the jobs no one else wants. They're only taking jobs away from the lazy idiots who sit around and eat up government money by scraping by with wellfare. C: Okay, because of 911 we're supposed to assume everyone's a terrorist now? Lol. And then A: ...Are you serious? We already have people spreading "crazy morals" who CAN vote. What about those people? Should they be denied to vote? Nuuu. Having different morals is part of being in America. We're a boiling pot, anythings okay (ok, not speaking literally). @casette: No, just certain people have "wicked morals". Most people are quite sane, I assure you. But again, like I said it's not fair to let them vote here if they're not citizens.
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Post by casettejongen on Nov 25, 2007 17:51:19 GMT -5
I meant the stupid things like Sesame Street being adult only and such things. So from the moment that they get a paper that says 'you are legal', it's immediately correct to let them vote? I think they should be seen as citizens, because the fact that they aren't 'legal' doesn't seem to depend on sane arguments.
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Post by lunachaos on Nov 25, 2007 18:06:52 GMT -5
Yes. Because if they're doing something illegal, like living in a country illegally, you should not have the rights people have that aren't breaking the law. Really, it's that simple.
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Post by Paraiba Ocean on Nov 25, 2007 18:10:09 GMT -5
Because the moment they get that paper, they have to start paying taxes unless they want to deal with Uncle Sam. If they're legal, clearly they cared enough to apply for citizenship and work their bums off so they could live here.
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Post by CountessRachel on Nov 25, 2007 18:58:13 GMT -5
Ugh. Statements like this drive me nuts. Reality is, there are tons of Americans (with families) who are poor and homeless who want the jobs the middle working class and higher do not want. The only problem with this country is that minimum wage is so freakin low and inflation is so high that those "unwanted" jobs are next to worthless to an American citizen in poverty and welfare ends up being more profitable. If it were the other way around we wouldn't have as many "lazy idiots" struggling to make ends meet through gov't assistance.
But to someone who comes from a country where a dollar can buy food for two weeks, that "unwanted" job is a gold mine. Again, like I said, many of them are not here to actually BE citizens, ergo they shouldn't have the right to vote.
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Post by lunachaos on Nov 25, 2007 21:04:24 GMT -5
I was actually speaking of the people aren't doing anything about their situation and CAN. I know there's people who struggle and are trying hard, since I know someone close who is in that situation. Sorry, should have been more specific >.<
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Post by spiritmage234 on Nov 25, 2007 21:08:55 GMT -5
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Post by decoy on Nov 25, 2007 21:51:11 GMT -5
I'm not saying that illegal immigrants should be allowed to vote. However, it's not by any random circumstance that they're showing up on our doorstep. Well it was originally their doorstep and we like stole it from them. Correct. Although, one would be inclined to disagree we stole it from "them" (being Mexicans etc.). Next time they should try winning the war. And if any land were "stolen", as you say, it would most likely be from the indigenous populace already established before the Europeans arrived. Anyway, all I was trying to state was the fact that we're a country that is supposed to be accepting of people who come here looking for a better life. It's shameful whenever a new group arrives that we treat them like dirt, time and time again.
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Post by WyrmKing on Nov 25, 2007 22:20:35 GMT -5
Well it was originally their doorstep and we like stole it from them. Correct. Although, one would be inclined to disagree we stole it from "them" (being Mexicans etc.). Next time they should try winning the war. And if any land were "stolen", as you say, it would most likely be from the indigenous populace already established before the Europeans arrived. Anyway, all I was trying to state was the fact that we're a country that is supposed to be accepting of people who come here looking for a better life. It's shameful whenever a new group arrives that we treat them like dirt, time and time again. They should try winning the war? How about we should try not occupying territories not ours? Did you think about that? Oh wait no, we're Americans, rules are different for us. Also, the Mexicans are indigenous, although they have mixed with the Spaniards, but they have mostly kicked the Spanish out too.
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Post by decoy on Nov 25, 2007 22:46:15 GMT -5
The Mexican Gov't (at the time) allowed US settlers into the province of Texas with the notions that it would help them to control their furthermost borders. However, Mexico's inability to properly control the borders found more settlers there than originally bargained.
After a few dictators and constitutions later the Texans became unruly and decided to revolt ultimately defeating the Mexican military sent to manage the rebellion. This caused the forming of the Republic of Texas which the Mexican Gov't would now refer to as a "rebel province."
Therefore, I do believe that it is safe to say that had the Mexican military/Gov't been able to claim victory in the wars against the Texans circa 1836 and/or America 1846-'48, then there really wouldn't be a whole lot to it.
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Post by WyrmKing on Nov 25, 2007 23:05:41 GMT -5
So I'm still right, they felt like it was their land even though it was still the Mexican government's. And of course, just took it because they felt entitled to it, even after the Mexican government was generous enough to let them in in exchange for some help. Hmmm, so they got backstabbed and yet it's still the Mexican's fault? Your logic fails me.
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Post by decoy on Nov 25, 2007 23:25:10 GMT -5
So I pose this question: Just because one is unable to soundly protect their borders and territories is it the other's fault if they take advantage of them?
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Post by WyrmKing on Nov 25, 2007 23:26:45 GMT -5
So by your logic, it was okay for the terrorist to blow up the twin towers because we were unable to stop it?
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