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Post by Ryth76 on Feb 5, 2007 1:07:08 GMT -5
You could also include a bit about characters that are based on canon characters that have questionable names. Such as Hope. Hope translates as Zhi Wang or Xi Wang in Chinese. Since Xi Wang translates as a verb in English, whereas Zhi Wang can translate as the noun 'hope' which is what the name Hope generally comes from, her name is Zhi Wang in muse form.
[quote author=writer board=fic thread=1169841028 post=1170621332]
<< Umm wise-guy. The Trio are Retros. Meaning they lived in the BEGINNING of the war. They all died before Aang awaken. Accually about 30 years before.
So please insert your foot in your mouth. As for Amaya. She's a very thought out character, and wonderfully disigned. I just feel that OCs don't need to be shipped with Canon. There is no such thing as a minor MS. Either your MS or not. Yomi and Mao are Gary Stus if you want to point out the fact that they angst alot. But they also connect to Chiko and that accually balances out, as foster parents with more responsblity then they could handle.
And honest Ryth, why are you defending Amaya? She's isn't your OC. Let Kali fight her own battles, Kay? [/quote]
Well, I did say 'unless you meant years before Aang woke up'... << (*tosses foot-in-mouth comment back*)
I was defending Amaya because I'm an creator of OCs that could be considered MS by that ruling (even though I'm very cautious about keeping characters balanced) and I tend to want to defend the creations people I respect and admire. And I meant it nicely, no offense. How was I supposed to know by your post that you liked Amaya? And the other part was just me rambling on. -__-;
What about fans who don't like any of the ships with their favorite character who want to write a romance using said character? They can either use a character they don't feel go with the character (which doesn't sound that fun), or they can create a balanced OC that they can use to deal with the problem (or a bad MS... x__x).
Actually, yes, there can be minor/lesser Sues. Or rather, OCs with MS like traits, such as traits that are controversial or traits that canon characters can get away with, but some people feel are a bit much for an OC. And having traits based on the writer (that's not always bad, unless it's an ideal version of the author). I consider the major/true MSs to be the agonizingly bad sparklypoo OCs. In other words, There are MSs that are really bad and can't be saved, and there are those that can get away with some MS traits or only need a little work on to fit in.
Or so all the anti-Sue guides and sites I've seen over the years have led me to believe... This isn't the first fandom I've been in my life that I've had to deal with Mary Sues and making sure my characters were balanced (granted I wasn't that good at it back then), you know.
My currently sitting semi-OC character could be called a Sue by some, so I consider her a lesser or minor Mary Sue. She has many traits of a balanced character, BUT Zuko ended up being her adoptive single parent up to six months or a year after season 3 ends. That does make her automatically a Sue in many people's eyes.
This is just a reply to your post, Bard Child. That is all.
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Post by writer on Feb 5, 2007 9:59:02 GMT -5
[quote author=writer board=fic thread=1169841028 post=1170621332]
<< Umm wise-guy. The Trio are Retros. Meaning they lived in the BEGINNING of the war. They all died before Aang awaken. Accually about 30 years before.
So please insert your foot in your mouth. As for Amaya. She's a very thought out character, and wonderfully disigned. I just feel that OCs don't need to be shipped with Canon. There is no such thing as a minor MS. Either your MS or not. Yomi and Mao are Gary Stus if you want to point out the fact that they angst alot. But they also connect to Chiko and that accually balances out, as foster parents with more responsblity then they could handle.
And honest Ryth, why are you defending Amaya? She's isn't your OC. Let Kali fight her own battles, Kay? [/quote]
I must have misread that so it's my error. << for Ayama. Maybe if you would accually would read my post you would have known.
Put that foot back that big o'le mouth of your's Ry.
Self-insertion and self paring what it comesdown too. I see most ten-year olds that have obbessions with Zuko do that << And you a character as a front.
They are still Mary Sues Never the less <<
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Post by Ryth76 on Feb 5, 2007 20:45:45 GMT -5
[quote author=writer board=fic thread=1169841028 post=1170621332]
<< Umm wise-guy. The Trio are Retros. Meaning they lived in the BEGINNING of the war. They all died before Aang awaken. Accually about 30 years before.
So please insert your foot in your mouth. As for Amaya. She's a very thought out character, and wonderfully disigned. I just feel that OCs don't need to be shipped with Canon. There is no such thing as a minor MS. Either your MS or not. Yomi and Mao are Gary Stus if you want to point out the fact that they angst alot. But they also connect to Chiko and that accually balances out, as foster parents with more responsblity then they could handle.
And honest Ryth, why are you defending Amaya? She's isn't your OC. Let Kali fight her own battles, Kay? I must have misread that so it's my error. << for Ayama. Maybe if you would accually would read my post you would have known. Put that foot back that big o'le mouth of your's Ry. [/quote] I didn't read that part when I posted my first post. Technically, you posted that after my post. I`m not psychic, you know Not for serious writers who are serious about writing a good story and who are very sensitive to MSs. Technically, just because you make an OC and you give it a couple of traits of yourself doesn't make it a self-insert or make it self-pairing when you give it for a canon character. I'm not a squealing fangirl, especially when it comes to writing, and I don't find any of the guy characters as someone I could have a romance with unless they were extremely OOC. I don't even find them appealing. Attractive yes, but appealing for passionate romance? No thanks. I'm a hardcore writer with a perfectionist streak toward her stories who hopes to one day get published, and I tend to treat my fanfics like I do the stories I hope to publish. Believe me, I'm not kind to any of my stories and I don't take kindly to self-inserts even in my non-fiction ideas and stories to publish. It's bad business, though traits and things you take from your own real life experiences are allowed. When a true writer finds something in the story that would make it difficult to sell, get published, or something that doesn't fit in the rules or guidelines of a publishing house they're aiming for, they shred the manuscript, remove/re-develop characters, and re-write chunks of it as needed. And I do the same. Story writing is like a business for me. I enjoy it and it is a hobby for me... but I don't get attached to the stories I write. Personally, if I would make an OC for a character, it would be because their part works if they're not single, but the plot only works if the other characters that could've been paired with the character were single. And then they would already be married for a few years or it would be a vague underlying thing isn't part of the main plot. If I make an OC having to do with a canon character other than shipping, it would be to be able to write a plotline for that particular character mirroring the mood and the plotline of said canon character's part in the original series. (At this point, more rambling follows ... be warned.) Like with my current muse. Her part has to do with a subplot, on the side of the main plot, for the now thirty or thirty-one year-old Fire Lord Zuko. The idea wouldn't have worked if I'd used a purely canon character. It somewhat resembles Prince Zuko's part in the show. Or at least the part referring to him and Ozai. As in, she disowns him and becomes a voluntary exile of sorts, then he has find her and figure out where he went wrong in her eyes and try to win back her love. The subplot is mostly Zuko-centric, though she does have a few of her own parts. The backstory had to be few months after the end of season 3 because I didn't want the Hope in the story to have an angsty past with remembering her real family and what happened to them, and I felt there was a good opening for a backstory that didn't call for Zuko or Iroh to be OOC in taking her in, but the opening only lasts for a time after the last season. And she had to be adopted because I wanted Zuko to be single for the sake of the plot. A wife for Zuko would've been unnecessary and I imagine it would hinder the story and the subplot greatly. Once again, I apologize for rambling on. I tend to get that way when talking about my muses and stories. What were we talking about again? J/k .
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Post by writer on Feb 5, 2007 21:43:28 GMT -5
^ Where my Concerta when we need it? << (kidding)
I know about serious writting. I'm not as serious, because honesty a very good writer killed my hopes for writing . Though Chiko has been in delopent for about a year now <<
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Post by Ryth76 on Feb 5, 2007 21:55:56 GMT -5
Really? That's a shame, because I think you have what it takes.
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Post by writer on Feb 6, 2007 11:01:02 GMT -5
No offsense Ryth, but you haven't read any of my publications. So your opinon holds no water..
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Post by Ryth76 on Feb 6, 2007 16:43:36 GMT -5
*Shrug* It was a compliment, and I still think you could.
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Post by writer on Feb 7, 2007 12:27:36 GMT -5
Well your complement is 'bout the equlivent of saying how much a movie rocked solely because you knew who acted in it but you never saw the flick.
If you want to praise me. Do it after you read something by me
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Post by Ryth76 on Feb 8, 2007 19:22:16 GMT -5
Hmm... Hate to burst your bubble, but I'm not even your friend, so why should I be lying about seeing some potential? I said I see potential because I was taught that anyone, with the will and guts to try, who likes to write and has dreams of becoming a serious author has potential. Most people think they have to be these fantastic super-human writers to have any potential, but that's a mental impossibility.
But that's according to all my schooling on the subject. Even though I was taught by published writers and studied books on the subject, I must be greatly mistaken by my teaching according to your infinite wisdom -__-
Just so you know, I just read some of your fanfics. Like I suspected, you are a good writer. Some mistakes here and there, but not an abundance of them, and the fics are really interesting. Your dialogue-writing skills are especially remarkable.
I think I've defended my intelligence and pride for daring to state my opinion enough... -__-
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Post by writer on Feb 8, 2007 20:49:23 GMT -5
Hmm... Hate to burst your bubble, but I'm not even your friend, so why should I be lying about seeing some potential? Because you thought some simple kindness will do good and blossom the potential for friendship, IMO I wrote and invented characters, to comfort myself during a divorce and fact that I was socially disabled. Plus my father was and is still an amazing writer and I always had dreams to write like he can, not to mention I read books like "Call of the Wild", "Chronicals of Narnia" and "Lost Years of Merlin" when I 9-10 years old. And at fifteen I read Shakespere and C.S Lewis more adult stuff, Like the "Great Divorce" and "The Screwtape Letters" for kicks. Still all of that didn't make me a fanstatic writer. Ryth, having potiental is just good as not having any if you don't do anything with it. I wrote few things. But having 3-4 reviews tops isn't comforting. Or encourging. Your sarcasm wasn't appricated. I was being honest. Sorry. But I have studied too, and if you look at my previous note about. Litrature was my only friend growing up. Teachers taught me alot and even my father. Still when a well known author in the fandom tells you, that you pretty much suck. Well that kills everything. And I know I want honest feedback. Then why don't you give me any feedback? PM would be nice or a review. Yesh, this is why I got cranky when you praised me. How would I know that you read any of my crap? I get no feedback.I"m sorry for "insulting" you. I just wanted a real reason. I get no feedback, I was severally disencouraged. When some tells me that I write good and they aren't my friend. I get supicious. I'm sorry, but I really don't have any confidence in myself. Still I love to weave stories. (Hence my name) I so even though nobody seems to care. I continue to write. PS. What did you read anyway? Done with my wangst. <<
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Post by Ryth76 on Feb 9, 2007 1:29:43 GMT -5
Hmm... Hate to burst your bubble, but I'm not even your friend, so why should I be lying about seeing some potential? Because you thought some simple kindness will do good and blossom the potential for friendship, IMO Except it's kind of hard for me to compliment someone on-line that I've just been debating with... But you couldn't have known that. Ah... I see. Sounds a lot like my raising, minus the divorce and parent that writes part. Only my older sister and I write, and I don't think either of us are great. But I think I started writing to become more like her, though. Maybe you scare them off . In all seriousness though, I can understand a lack of confidence. I speak big about what I know about writing as a career, and how I would handle some things in stories, but as far as my actual writing and how people think of them... Anyway, 3-4 reviews, some very good critiques, isn't that bad, considering I haven't found a flame. You also won a contest, something not everyone manages to do. Also, they're better than reviews like "Good. Update soon." which I got a lot. Hmm... Though why it isn't higher than that is a mystery, considering they are well-written stories. Then again, this could be because the Avatar fanfiction community is very big and therefore aggression is the key to being read. I suggest that the problem lies in something outside the actual content. I had a lot of trouble with that when I was writing stories a couple years back. One friend told me that the more you comment on other people's stories, the more likely you'll get reviews. That could've been the only reason why I got any reviews and comments on some stories, since they were all people I was reviewing (kind of a "I scratch your back; you scratch my back" thing). Maybe it would help if you doubled your reviews for other people. Also some people are so cautious about reading MSs, that they won't read any OC-stories. And I know Airbenders don't attract as much attention as other benders. I guess because if a story has Airbenders in it, there's no chance of a popular character or ship being in it, except maybe Aang, and that puts off people who want to read only about those things. And the MS-wary who don't know you for being anti-MS, of course. These two factors together generally lower a writer's chances of getting reviewed or read. Other things that could decrease the amount of input and feedback is errors in the summaries (spelling, gender-switching, etc.) or not wording it in a way that would catch people's eyes so they would read it. Just some observations... I tend to go into essay mode easily ^^;; (Funny... I've never written an essay.) I'm sorry I got mad. I know you've studied. I really had no right to say what I did. *Shrug* Sounds like someone too full of themselves to me... Then again, what can I say? I know absolutely nothing about what happened. Because I don't have an account on FF.net right now, and I feel uncomfortable commenting on FF.net as anonymous, for some reason. I guess I really should get an account... I'm sorry I got angry . I have a lot of difficulty explaining what I meant, which is why I didn't really bother to post my explanation about what I said beforehand. Sorry. A Lullaby for a RoseBrothers of the TyphoonThriveBe Gone! Thou Spirit! (I actually read this months ago, but didn't realize you wrote it... My bad ^^ All of them except the last, I've only read today. That's good ;D
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Post by writer on Feb 9, 2007 9:30:50 GMT -5
Oh wow. You read Brothers? and a Lullaby? O.O Well, Ransom of a Red Chief is my newest chapter fic. and I have an orginal one in Other Creations
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Post by Ryth76 on Feb 9, 2007 18:37:18 GMT -5
Yeah, they aren't that long, and I'm fast. ;D
I'll be sure to check Ransom of a Red Chief out sometime, and the original story. ^^
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Post by writer on Feb 9, 2007 19:48:52 GMT -5
Thanks, :3
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